I guess I need to identify the two teachers who did the most for my spiritual growth:
Robert Theme and John MacArthur
Not sure I should post anymore as I know these two men don’t rate very high here! ! !
š¤
I was never exposed to the “Colonel” until late…I’ve given away/thrown away the substantial amount of MacArthur stuff I had…still have a couple of his Bibles I can’t give away and I’m too superstitious to toss them… š
Former teachers I didnāt dump:
Dr. J. Vernon McGee
Dr. Walter R. Martin
They might have said something once or twice that I disagreed with but I didnāt feel like I had to switch āem off for good.
Growing up Assemblies of God in western Oregon I NEVER liked John MacArthur. I know he’s been beneficial to others but I grew up in the Wilamette Valley and was an AG youth introduced to Gordon Fee by my youth pastor at the time (Dale Oquist), alongside Solzhenitsyn and Francis Schaeffer.
I’d say I moved on from Schaeffer, for sure and Solzhenitsyn doesn’t even count as a formal theologian.
I did like McGee in my teens and dispensationalist though he was I never heard him discuss that stuff. I managed to switch to amillennialism and partial preterism pretty much as soon as my Assembly of God youth pastor explained what those concepts were as part of his crash course on interpreting scripture with help from Gordon Fee. He said he had his own view but he believed his first obligation as a pastor was to teach us the whole range of eschatological schools of thought and then let us work out what our own convictions were about what views we held to.
Later when I went to a private Christian college up here in Seattle a NT prof told me he wasn’t sure I realized how astonishingly fortunate I was to have had a youth pastor like that. Well, I’m pushing 50 now and I think I DO appreciate it.
I benefited from Bonhoeffer and N. T Wright and J. I. Packer in my 20s. By my 30s I added Richard Bauckham, Augustine, Richard Sibbes and David Martyn-Lloyd Jones (Dad was into him and I think he had a good word or two about I. Howard Marshall). By my 40s I added Adolf Schlatter, Emil Brunner, Esther Acolatse, Robert Ewusie Moses, Graham Twelftree, John of Damascus, John Owen, and a few others. I somehow managed to be at Mars Hill for years and never figured out why anyone was so excited about John Piper and am still not sure I get what the deal is with Sproul. I don’t “dislike” them like I’ve disliked MacArthur but I never got what the deal was about them.
Maybe they’re just not for me. Brunner I’ve belatedly gotten to and I’m really digging him. Also John Neville Figgis. So Swiss Reformed and Anglican stuff, I guess. But for all that I never dropped Gordon Fee.
I doubt I need to even mention the name of the guy whose work I “did” drop. š
I tossed Thieme – then Lewis Sperry Chafer – then Watchman Nee – then I tossed Bill Gothard (this was still early) the rationalist Francis Schaffer (before his son tossed him) and Frank was easy to dismiss.
The dispensationalists went as a group except for their very illustrative teaching – you know the Swindoll type stuff. Then the Calvinists had to go – except Steve Brown – heās going to the grave with me.
There are a few that will last my lifetimeā¦ foremost P T Forsyth – that man had a profound Gospel
Above all that is the question – Do you have a Gospel. Nothing else matters.
I will preach twice today and that is all that will matter. The Gospel must possess those who proclaim it.
It also pleased God by the revelation of His holiness and grace, which the great theologians taught me to find in the Bible, to bring home to me my sin in a way that submerged all the school questions in weight, urgency, and poignancy. I was turned from a Christian to a believer, from a lover of love to an object of grace. And so, whereas I first thought that what the Churches needed was enlightened instruction and liberal theology, I came to be sure that what they needed was evangelization, in something more than the conventional sense of that word. āWhat we need is not the dechurching of Christianity, but the Christianizing of the Church.ā Positive Preaching and the Modern Mind
Paul said it more succinctly … 15Ā But when he who had set me apart before I was born, and who called me by his grace, 16Ā was pleased to reveal his Son in me, in order that I might preach him Ga 1:15ā16.
I was teaching last night and realized that (even though I rarely hear him anymore) Steve Brown’s gospel is my Gospel and I do not know where he ends and I begin.
Forsyth is destined to be someone I regret not having the time to pursue…
Bonhoeffer has commanded use of the space of others…and voices from the East as I can comprehend them..
I’ve said it before, but unloaded all my Courson ‘commentaries’ at once as a White Elephant Christmas “gift.” The recipient was overjoyed & completely missed my sarcastic point. My library has never been happier.
my list will never compare to the aforementioned authors/theologians–and I don’t hold myself to the likes of the commenters either, but ministry/theology isn’t my vocation or passion and can’t afford the time given my teaching career. Perhaps when I retire I’ll return to the traces.
Alan’s passing comment, “The Gospel must possess those who proclaim it.” was golden.
The charges pending related to Trump’s affair with Daniels has nothing to do with the laison or the payment, but how it was “laundered” financially in the books. The former charges should have more effect on those of the faith who hold to a so-called Biblical Worldview–but for whatever reasons, the ex-pres gets a pass on those.
I will only say this (for now). Trump’s overt references to violence, bloodshed, and attacks on political or judicial foes this past week should weaken the knees and chill the spines of any of his supporters who believe him to be a legitimate candidate for the highest office in our land. He’s gone off the deep end.
My biggest problem with John Mac is the same with most pastors – Jesus isnāt enough.
No matter what they claim, Jesusā life and words is never enough material for those who want others to be like them – their opinions, quirks, pet hobbies, etc.
Whatās concerned me is why they needs to.
If John isnāt careful heās going to not like heaven with me and all āthoseā people of whom he condemns.
Michael, funny you would admit to superstition. Guess Iām there too. I havenāt been able to toss my MacArthur study Bible. Maybe Iāll take it to Goodwill. At least Iāll get a tax right-off for it. Lol.
I’m convinced that diversity in the Body of Christ isn’t a result of the fall, but different fish like different bait…as long as you end up with Jesus, it’s all good…
It’s all yours today…
Waco Texas – Itās telling that the American false prophets return to their vomit.
I guess I need to identify the two teachers who did the most for my spiritual growth:
Robert Theme and John MacArthur
Not sure I should post anymore as I know these two men don’t rate very high here! ! !
š¤
Em,
You turned out fine despite them… š
R. B. Thieme what a character? The Colonel ā would throw me out on sight. Threw his stuff away first.
I was never exposed to the “Colonel” until late…I’ve given away/thrown away the substantial amount of MacArthur stuff I had…still have a couple of his Bibles I can’t give away and I’m too superstitious to toss them… š
That would be an interesting thread…former teachers I’ve dumped…
MacArthur
Piper
Most of James White
All Calvary Chapel affiliated stuff…
Dave Hunt
Jack Hayford
Most of Sproul…
Former teachers I didnāt dump:
Dr. J. Vernon McGee
Dr. Walter R. Martin
They might have said something once or twice that I disagreed with but I didnāt feel like I had to switch āem off for good.
God uses all sorts of different people at different times…I gleaned something from all the above…and learned how to both keep and discard.
I simply don’t have any space left for dispensationalism…but others do…
Growing up Assemblies of God in western Oregon I NEVER liked John MacArthur. I know he’s been beneficial to others but I grew up in the Wilamette Valley and was an AG youth introduced to Gordon Fee by my youth pastor at the time (Dale Oquist), alongside Solzhenitsyn and Francis Schaeffer.
I’d say I moved on from Schaeffer, for sure and Solzhenitsyn doesn’t even count as a formal theologian.
I did like McGee in my teens and dispensationalist though he was I never heard him discuss that stuff. I managed to switch to amillennialism and partial preterism pretty much as soon as my Assembly of God youth pastor explained what those concepts were as part of his crash course on interpreting scripture with help from Gordon Fee. He said he had his own view but he believed his first obligation as a pastor was to teach us the whole range of eschatological schools of thought and then let us work out what our own convictions were about what views we held to.
Later when I went to a private Christian college up here in Seattle a NT prof told me he wasn’t sure I realized how astonishingly fortunate I was to have had a youth pastor like that. Well, I’m pushing 50 now and I think I DO appreciate it.
I benefited from Bonhoeffer and N. T Wright and J. I. Packer in my 20s. By my 30s I added Richard Bauckham, Augustine, Richard Sibbes and David Martyn-Lloyd Jones (Dad was into him and I think he had a good word or two about I. Howard Marshall). By my 40s I added Adolf Schlatter, Emil Brunner, Esther Acolatse, Robert Ewusie Moses, Graham Twelftree, John of Damascus, John Owen, and a few others. I somehow managed to be at Mars Hill for years and never figured out why anyone was so excited about John Piper and am still not sure I get what the deal is with Sproul. I don’t “dislike” them like I’ve disliked MacArthur but I never got what the deal was about them.
Maybe they’re just not for me. Brunner I’ve belatedly gotten to and I’m really digging him. Also John Neville Figgis. So Swiss Reformed and Anglican stuff, I guess. But for all that I never dropped Gordon Fee.
I doubt I need to even mention the name of the guy whose work I “did” drop. š
I tossed Thieme – then Lewis Sperry Chafer – then Watchman Nee – then I tossed Bill Gothard (this was still early) the rationalist Francis Schaffer (before his son tossed him) and Frank was easy to dismiss.
The dispensationalists went as a group except for their very illustrative teaching – you know the Swindoll type stuff. Then the Calvinists had to go – except Steve Brown – heās going to the grave with me.
There are a few that will last my lifetimeā¦ foremost P T Forsyth – that man had a profound Gospel
Above all that is the question – Do you have a Gospel. Nothing else matters.
I will preach twice today and that is all that will matter. The Gospel must possess those who proclaim it.
P T Forsyth
It also pleased God by the revelation of His holiness and grace, which the great theologians taught me to find in the Bible, to bring home to me my sin in a way that submerged all the school questions in weight, urgency, and poignancy. I was turned from a Christian to a believer, from a lover of love to an object of grace. And so, whereas I first thought that what the Churches needed was enlightened instruction and liberal theology, I came to be sure that what they needed was evangelization, in something more than the conventional sense of that word. āWhat we need is not the dechurching of Christianity, but the Christianizing of the Church.ā Positive Preaching and the Modern Mind
Paul said it more succinctly … 15Ā But when he who had set me apart before I was born, and who called me by his grace, 16Ā was pleased to reveal his Son in me, in order that I might preach him Ga 1:15ā16.
Reveal his son IN ME? Yes the Gospel.
I’m no fan of Donald Trump, but what business is it of the Government how much he paid an upscale courtesan to keep her silence?
I was teaching last night and realized that (even though I rarely hear him anymore) Steve Brown’s gospel is my Gospel and I do not know where he ends and I begin.
Forsyth is destined to be someone I regret not having the time to pursue…
Bonhoeffer has commanded use of the space of others…and voices from the East as I can comprehend them..
WTH,
Fee should never be discarded…if only for his passion …
I’ve said it before, but unloaded all my Courson ‘commentaries’ at once as a White Elephant Christmas “gift.” The recipient was overjoyed & completely missed my sarcastic point. My library has never been happier.
my list will never compare to the aforementioned authors/theologians–and I don’t hold myself to the likes of the commenters either, but ministry/theology isn’t my vocation or passion and can’t afford the time given my teaching career. Perhaps when I retire I’ll return to the traces.
Alan’s passing comment, “The Gospel must possess those who proclaim it.” was golden.
“Alanās passing comment, āThe Gospel must possess those who proclaim it.ā was golden.”
I’ll say the amen…
The charges pending related to Trump’s affair with Daniels has nothing to do with the laison or the payment, but how it was “laundered” financially in the books. The former charges should have more effect on those of the faith who hold to a so-called Biblical Worldview–but for whatever reasons, the ex-pres gets a pass on those.
I can’t comment on Trump on the Lord’s Day …I wish he would simply go away.
I will only say this (for now). Trump’s overt references to violence, bloodshed, and attacks on political or judicial foes this past week should weaken the knees and chill the spines of any of his supporters who believe him to be a legitimate candidate for the highest office in our land. He’s gone off the deep end.
His supporters don’t care…
I guess the word “should” should be expunged from our vocabulary…along with “ought,” “must,” and “oblige.”
the so-called “right” is practicing cancel culture. š
Michael @ 5:45 pm
What I learned from both Theme and MacArthur is that our God isn’t Santy Claus.
The fear of God is the beginning of wisdom…….
My biggest problem with John Mac is the same with most pastors – Jesus isnāt enough.
No matter what they claim, Jesusā life and words is never enough material for those who want others to be like them – their opinions, quirks, pet hobbies, etc.
Whatās concerned me is why they needs to.
If John isnāt careful heās going to not like heaven with me and all āthoseā people of whom he condemns.
Michael, funny you would admit to superstition. Guess Iām there too. I havenāt been able to toss my MacArthur study Bible. Maybe Iāll take it to Goodwill. At least Iāll get a tax right-off for it. Lol.
UnCCed, JMac has just become an old curmudgeon.
Em,
I’m convinced that diversity in the Body of Christ isn’t a result of the fall, but different fish like different bait…as long as you end up with Jesus, it’s all good…
Thanks, Michael – point taken. š¤
Johnny Mac will either be irritated or surprised at all those who are in heaven. As far as I am concerned, heās just a mean old S.O.B.
I plan on bringing my past and present dog friends up to J Mac in Glory lol!
Mean old S.O.B?
Sigh…..
The Nashville shooting today was at a PCA private Christian school.
“heās just a mean old S.O.B.”
Training others to be the same…I just ignore him when possible…