Things I Think…
1. The less than surprising report that “prophet” Mike Bickle is credibly accused of long term sexual misconduct brought to my mind an interview I did recently on the subject of clergy abuse.
The interviewer asked me what I would like people to understand about guys like Bickle, Coy, Rozelle,etc. The answer kind of just jumped out of my mouth….what I’d like people to understand is that these men are not Christians and probably never have been.
2. “You will know them by their fruit”…abusing people for decades and sexual deviance are not fruits of the Spirit…truly regenerate people can and do experience moral and ethical failure…but they repent of that failure and make their repentance as widely known as the reach of their sin…
3. You may argue that one cannot know for sure about the spiritual state of another person…I would argue that in the case of unrepentant leaders, the question is irrelevant.
““If another believer sins against you, go privately and point out the offense. If the other person listens and confesses it, you have won that person back. But if you are unsuccessful, take one or two others with you and go back again, so that everything you say may be confirmed by two or three witnesses. If the person still refuses to listen, take your case to the church. Then if he or she won’t accept the church’s decision, treat that person as a pagan or a corrupt tax collector.” (Matthew 18:15-17 NLT-SE)
4. It is not the fault of the church that wolves in sheeps clothing use the church for their own wicked endeavors…it’s the churches fault when they fail to deal with wolves biblically…and feed them more sheep instead of breaking their teeth…
5. The besetting sin of God’s people through the ages is idolatry and that sin is in full flower in this age…idolizing ungodly leaders and refusing to remove them because of their charisma or natural gifting has produced a generation of unredeemed leadership that has feasted on the people of God and brought shame to the name of Jesus…
6. Worse yet…it has produced pseudo sheep who look just like their leaders and look nothing like Christ…the number of unregenerate people thinking themselves in the Body of Christ has grown exponentially with the idolatry…
7. There are biblical standards for leadership…standards the rest of the church are demanded to respect and enforce. The failure to do so reflects the fact that holiness has become a foreign concept to people who are supposed to embody it…
8. The farther you get away from the modern “prophetic” movement, the closer you’ll get to true Christianity…
9. If you think this is a picture of a Christian leader, you’re part of the problem…
10. Yes, there are days when I wonder about myself…but through faith and repentance and the grace of God…I do know Jesus…
Babylon is fallen!
I spent years at a church where the leadership constantly reminded us to beware of wolves trying to enter the church. Turned out that the wolves were already there standing behind the pulpit.
Amen to #9. I can’t believe how so many are deceived by this man! At the same time, they believe that those against him are deceived.
Dread,
We still have time to come out of her…
Bob,
He is just a symptom of our disease…
#6 “Worse yet…it has produced pseudo sheep who look and act just like the pastor…” This is chilling. Perhaps this explains why so many young people are leaving the evangelical church, especially young women. Those who leave often mention the ‘hypocrisy’ they see in the church. If the ‘Wolves in Sheep’s Clothing’ are sitting in the pews as well as standing behind the pulpit, then the church becomes a very unsafe place indeed.
Janet Linn, BrideofChrist,
You have nailed it…a very unsafe place indeed…
#9 Yeah…”Two Corinthians.”
Give me a major break.
I am popping in to say that while I do not have time to comment I am faithfully reading (and as always enjoying it).
Shawn,
Always glad to see you here….
Yes and Amen to all 10!!
Thanks, CK!
Probably not most people’s musical cup of tea, but 30 years ago Michael Knott wrote a rock opera album about the Kansas City prophets… interesting that even though he had his own demons and the whole alternative Christian music genre he came from was pretty tightly tied to Calvary Chapel, he was still able to recognize that something was amiss in an amazingly prophetic way: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=elzR_ffw9mQ&list=PLZJnoYRv3_xD4WwFEK8qUI7qTLT_D46Zy
Steve in Canada,
And Steve Hindalong (God of Wonders) was the spoken voice of The Grape Prophet!
# 1- The whole structure and teaching of IHOP has always bothered me. I’m suspicious of any church group that puts their leadership on a pedestal and requires their members to bow to him/her instead of to Jesus.
I had that Mike Knott/LSU album in mind today. It is very off-putting and revealing in ways that CCM almost never is. Knott made music so weird and disquieting it would have been out of place in the secular world, let alone KLOVE.
One of the things that drives me nuts is when a Christian leader is revealed to have serious problems (I hear it in charismatic and/or Indy Baptist circles the most) and someone always says “Be careful not to throw out the baby with the bathwater.” That advice wouldn’t be that bad —- if defenders hadn’t demanded the baby and bathwater be a package deal for the past 30+ years.
I’ve had a fair amount of interaction with The International House of Prayer, KC Metro Vineyard, etc, of which Bickle has been leader. Their origin story is all about “words from the lord” from the Kansas City Prophets. Bob Jones and Paul Cain being the most prominent. Those two both went down hard with very public sexual failures themselves.
Its clear to me that IHOP gave more weight to this prophetic house of cards than to scripture and sound doctrine. Their ministry model was based on burning out youth volunteers who they could easily replace. It was a revolving door of 24/7 prayer and prophecy exhaustion.
Paul Cain was an old homosexual and Jones was a pervert.
Not Christians…not prophets…just predators who found a racket.
The fish rots from the head down…seems to affect these freaks in the groin area too…
You (generic you) don’t have to be queer or a pervert to find mighty rich diggins’ in the Jeezus racket.
More than a few straight people (TBN, Daystar, et al) have made vast fortunes off the fears and tears of hurting people looking for relief from their pain.
“The Spirit and the bride say, “Come.” And let everyone who hears say, “Come.” And let everyone who is thirsty come. Let anyone who wishes take the water of life as a gift”. Revelation 22:17
Even so, come Lord Jesus!
Michael – Standing behind Cain and Jones is the ghost of William Branham. They exhumed the 50 years dead Latter Rain doctrine and came up with “Joel’s Army”. Contrary to any good interpretation, the locusts in Joel don’t represent the cruel Babylonian army. Joel’s locusts are God’s radical end times youth warriors, praying and declaring the great tribulation judgement upon the world.