Linkathon!
Bob Coy accused of molesting child…we’ll have a lot more on this later
Evangelical distinctives in the 21st century…
Should evangelicals change their name?
Art and theology in worship space…
Is evangelical something recent?
Reclaiming the Trinity from Father, Son, and Holy Book…
The jeans and t-shirt orthodoxy of Rich Mullins…
Don’t use Joseph and Mary to justify child molestation…
It matters how you tell the truth…
33% of Protestant churchgoers don’t know about Billy Graham’s ministry…
How to stay close to God during the holidays…
Protect your congregation from a gunman…
Huge thanks to EricL…support his work at top right!
Well, that’s stomach turning. (Bob Coy). Such depravity. Lord Jesus, come quickly.
Lots of good reads here. Two link I am particularly interested in:
1. Godless Meteorology – I am a meteorologist, so this should be interesting.
2. Rich Mullins article – one of my favorite all-time artists.
Thanks!
As you can imagine, it’s been a crazy morning.
I’ll be on and off…we’re also recording our podcast again this morning…
Unless you are damn sure the Coy story is true, you should not be spreading this around.
As for the truth of whether or not the molestation occurred, it’s possible only Coy and his accuser know the truth with certainty. As for the truth of whether or not the charges have been made and have some substance to them, I believe Michael would be quite sure about such before publicizing.
The problem with all these sexual assault / molestation charges is that there is no consequence for false charges. My brother went through this a couple of years ago. My nephew and his wife had a nasty divorce, and I mean a nasty one and over the next couple of years she turned his 4 kids against him and after some time got them to claim that he molested them. I have no way of knowing if this was true or not but the whole thing was the culmination of her wanting more money. My brother is a wealthy man and so that they could see the grandkids, he paid money all the time to meet her demands.
When he cut it off, she filed a claim that my brother had molested the kids. He was the deep pockets and she was going after him – for 3 years they went through hell before the judge finally threw it out.
Any consequence to her? Nope, she was allowed to have her fishing expedition and see what she could reel in. Her ass should be in jail.
Pastoral experience has taught me that reason plays no role in either sexual molestation or lying about others. We are currently in a vise grip of people who see an open door for their lies and those who see a possibility of justice.
Let me be clear. Exploiting others sexually is evil, vile, and must be stopped at every opportunity. However, liars abound and they do not lie rationally. The impulse to lie is as unreasonable as the impulse to sexualize the powerless. Both do violence.
Not everything people are accused of doing is true.
MLD,
There are legal consequences for making false accusations, at least when the accusations have been made within the legal system. But just like there are those who are truly guilty of abuse and get off because of there not being enough evidence to convict, the same goes for those who make false accusations. It goes both ways.
I’ve had to live with this story for months.
Because my first duty is to protect the victim, there is a large amount of evidence that cannot be publicly posted.
Instead of doing this story on my own I chose to let the “professionals” handle it and I think Tim did a great job.
There has been a lot of time, work, tears, and prayer put in by a lot of people.
in the recent past as i read the news, over and over i am seeing educators (mostly women and middle and high school) being accused of exploiting their male students sexually… unthinkable, inconceivable deviancy… IMV this is, like the promotion of homosexuality, a symptom of a very corrupted and sick civilization… there were/are some O.T. prophets who saw this coming, so we should not be surprised, i guess…
My wife’s sister has 5 daughters. All grown now. The youngest who is 29 reached out to me a couple of years ago on Facebook.
We would occasionally interact. I helped her purchase some college school books, etc. She’s married, no kids. Turns out there’s a lot of strife in their family.
Anyways, a few mos ago she posted this alarming post on Facebook that she “remembered” her father had sexually abused her when she was a teen, etc.
At first I was shocked and didn’t no what to say. Replying that I was sorry to read that. Next thing I know all hell broke less. The other family members started calling us, accusing me of encouraging her to make an substantiated and crazy accusation.
To make a long story long, she recanted the story (after the damage was publicly done) stating that she had taken to much cough syrup medicine and went into an altered state of reality.
Most of the family on their side is still upset with me.
I’ve since done some research on False Memory Syndrome. Unfortunately, it is a huge problem societally. Brought on and fostered by so-called counsellors.
Many families have been damaged because of this. Sadly, even more have been damaged by the real abuse that exists.
We are a messed up human race.
i would pray that all would take Pastor Dread’s #7 to heart… anyone who has been on the receiving end of false accusations that are “generally accepted as truth” has a front row seat to just how evil the human heart tends to go – both that of the liar and the gossips who spread the lie… even among good church folk…
i run from thinking about any good person that i may have avoided because of what i “heard about” them…
Please. Some red flags to be aware of here. Based on years of experience working with sexually abused children and youth as well as decades of research available on the subject: a large number of recantations are made based on ending the turmoil and pain the original reporting caused, not that the allegations were indeed fabricated. It is a common occurance in physical abuse as well. It happens even when forensic evidence is present. As explicit as physical injury and bodily fluids.
It is similar in many ways to how grown women will decide not to press charges on their abusers. Children and youth are even more vulnerable to such pressures. It has only been fairly recently that some states will prosecute based on evidence w/o the collaborating testimony of the victim.
I do not wish to minimize how devastating it is to be falsely accused, but care only to raise awareness that those cases are extremely rare. It is much more common for real victims to be accused of lying, and revictimized for coming forward.
This week in the general media, now further revelation re: Coy have exhausted me. I weep, groan and shake my fists at the heavens over the wreckage.
I have a friend (and one time colleague) who suffered sexual abuse from the age of 5 to when she was ten at the hands of a neighbor. Her parents were unaware even when she tried to tell them (things were very different in the 50s). The best she could do was to try to keep her younger sisters away from the man, even when it meant that she placed herself in harms way. The experience, which on more than one occasion included threats of violence if she told (she still finds it hard today to look at a knife), scarred her deeply. The man was never brought to justice. My friend has gone for counseling and therapy off and on for 20 years, especially when nightmares recur.
Yes, there can be false accusations, but I can say from doing some work in a women’s shelter and counseling service that when you look through a one way mirror and see a six year old girl pointing at a place on a doll and saying “he touched me here”, it is very believable… and real.
We obviously cannot know everything even from a multi-sourced news article such as this, but I think the real concern should be for the purported victim and, if at all possible, making sure there are no future victims.
Scooter – I have a relative who experienced actual abuse, but also at the hands of such unscrupulous repressed memory “counselors “ became at one point convinced every male relative and/or family friend at some time abused her: So please understand I can sympathize with the variety of dilemmas this horrible subject brings up.
Anne, most of us here are with you in your tears and frustration… God has a special place in hell for those who intentionally abuse children – still, in light of that, it gives one pause if one is a Believer to think that resentment, even though justified, would keep us from praying for their souls…
in your experience, are the accusations that are false most likely to occur in divorce proceedings such as was described above?
Don’t believe that hearsay story about Bob Coy. So much hate was written into that article. Anti Republican, Anti Calvary.. Is it maddening that Bob Coy raised 103 million dollars in one yr that has you so bitter? Judge not…. What’s in your closet sir?
I do not know the reporters political stance.
I do know that he is not “anti-Calvary” as he had little knowledge of CC at all.
This is not hearsay…
Thank you, Michael for pursuing things with Coy and CC.
Even if someone were to labor over the truth of the latest Coy story, it doesn’t negate that CC’s power structure was set up in favor of the sickest of people running their show without anyone to stop them. All a person had to do was be personable and have the prerequisite instant sanctification story and they were in. They could hide anything after that. Then there is the characteristic wall of silence that keeps a lid on the stupid committed by so many of these guys. Many are on the gravy train in these Mega Churches so it’s in their interests to cover it up. Who cares what God may think. It’s not like Chuckie was going to remove them either. I still have to ask the question, “What if Chuck would have done the right thing and stepped down when he became Biblically disqualified?” There is so much polluted water under that bridge and so many people who suffered from pedophiles and predatory pastors that should have been removed. Chuck owns that and all the people who covered for both Chuck and these sick pastors do, too. Their continued silence is their condemnation. Many people, even those among the ODMs are prone to their idolatries, though. And it goes on and on.
Here is story that might be of interest. I did not see it
included in the long list of CC inspired debauchery.
Below it is a link to a more thorough treatment of it.
Jennifer Soules, The Republic | azcentral.comPublished 5:10 p.m. MT May 14, 2015 | Updated 7:12 p.m. MT May 14, 2015
azcentral placeholder Crime
(Photo: azcentral)
Members of a U.S. Marshals Service task force in southern Arizona arrested a former pastor wanted in the 2011 murder of a Florida woman, a spokesman for the department said.
James Ty Flanders, 46, was arrested Thursday in Cochise, a community about 80 miles east of Tucson, where officials say he had been living with family.
Flanders is accused of killing Marie Carlson, 37, who disappeared in October 2011 from Fort Walton Beach, Florida, where she lived with Flanders. Carlson was the mother of Flanders’ child, said Nathan Alexander, a deputy U.S. Marshal in Tucson.
Carlson’s ex-husband reported her missing after receiving a cryptic message from her cellphone, Alexander said. Flanders, who was a pastor at Calvary Emerald Coast Church, later told investigators that he realized Carlson and her vehicle were missing but didn’t think to report it to authorities, Alexander said.
It wasn’t clear if Carlson’s body or vehicle were ever found.
Alexander said the U.S. Marshals Service worked with the Okaloosa County Sheriff’s Office and the Florida Department of Law Enforcement to track Flanders to Arizona, where they discovered he was living with family in Cochise.
Flanders was arrested without incident and booked into Cochise County Jail, where he awaits extradition to Florida.
The welfare of Flanders’ child was not available. Alexander directed inquiries to the Okaloosa County Sheriff’s Office, which did not immediately return a call for comment Thursday afternoon.
Former pastor pleads in murder case involving missing woman (VIDEOS)
Former pastor pleads in murder case involving missing woman (VIDEOS)
By TOM McLAUGHLIN
FORT WALTON BEACH — Former pastor James Ty Flanders pleaded guilty Thursday to killing Marie Jane Carlson in Oct…
Hmmm. Link didn’t show up. I’ll try again:
http://www.nwfdailynews.com/news/20160428/former-pastor-pleads-in-murder-case-involving-missing-woman-videos
Em – no. They run the gamut of family situations and dynamics. Both in my experience and statistically. The one I remember most vividly personally was with an adult woman I was counseling whose step father actually did time. As part of her recovery as an adult, she asked his forgiveness. He forgave her, saying he hurt her, her siblings and mother in so many other ways that prison had been the best place for him to go.
One of the only consistent dynamics I see over time is the more well to do, popular scoundrels always getting away with more, with less consequence.
Em – there may be more current research I am unaware of that indicates shifting dynamics I am unaware of. The world is changing rapidly and all research is already 4-5 + years removed from real time sometimes before published: At least back in my day. Maybe turn over quicker now.
The headline in the Billy Graham article is misleading. The majority had heard, seen or read him, 33% hadn’t. Only 4% didn’t know who he was.
So AGAIN, instead of “evangelical” we should just go with “Christian?”
Did I miss a better label?
I’ll continue to use “nondenominational”
Which really is the worst descriptive term of all—it tells so very little.
And my “company” could be worse than that indicated by “evangelical.”
Hey Preacher….They fired Bob Coy from the Funky Biscuit after this alleged allegation where this young girl ….I will bet you are ecstatic! There is no way you are any man of God .. Why don’t you try to teach Love ….not hate.
Enn Qua,
If I didn’t love the church and those who dwell within it, I wouldn’t bother soiling myself with the actions of those who would defile it and them.