Loose Ends

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58 Responses

  1. Ricky Bobby says:

    Thanks, great straightforward real-life example regarding 0bamacare/ACA.

    It would be great to just get the facts sans the political spin and hyperbole from both sides….though I can’t resist engaging in the hyperbole 🙂

  2. Nonnie says:

    Back in the 90’s I read several of Clancey’s books. They were great to read on the beach. I am very sorry to hear of his death.

  3. Headless Unicorn Guy says:

    “This makes me too angry to even comment on it…”

    Nothing Hal Lindsay didn’t already claim in “SATAN is Alive and Well and Living on Planet Earth”. (Back when Henry Kissinger was The Antichrist.)

  4. Headless Unicorn Guy says:

    “Finally today… since when did being a pastor give someone the ability to speak authoritatively on every subject from science to politics?”

    “Because Missionary Man he got Gawd on his side…”
    — The Eurythmics, “Missionary Man”

  5. crownedone1 says:

    “At this point, I do not see how this helps the unemployed or the working poor.”

    I do not believe it is supposed to. The purpose of the ACA plans seems to be to boost the economy through a forced “tax”. They are trying to figure out how to get out of debt, so they attacked a part of our industry responsible for 1/6th of our economy.

    I think “helping the uninsured” is merely a mask. Once you take the mask off, all I see is greed and forced taxation.

  6. Michael says:

    I loved that song…

  7. EricL says:

    Thanks for sharing the $$ figures. It helps to bring it all into perspective (good and bad). Also, I really appreciate your final thought about pastoral arrogance. I just said something similar to my wife a couple weeks ago. Some pastors act too much like celebrities. They think that having an audience makes them an instant-expert on any topic that catches their interest. They should respect their congregation more than that and, frankly, fear mishandling the position that God has allowed them to have. You needn’t avoid current events but you should step very lightly into any of those fields, knowing that you don’t have all the answers to everything under the sun. Humility is a good suit for a pastor to wear each Sunday. Admit your ignorance of things beyond your narrow field of expertise. Last I checked, seminaries don’t offer advanced classes on biology, astrophysics, archaeology, psychiatry, political science, secular history, astronomy, and so on.

  8. Steve Wright says:

    Michael, thank you for sharing. You don’t need to open yourself that way but it is appreciated given the heated discussion. (Small correction – they have had 3 1/2 years to work on this, not just two)

    I am not sure if you purchased coverage or not but at an estimated $25,000 income your IRS penalty would be $250 for 2014 if you don’t – rising a few hundred dollars each year thereafter.

    Without asking what YOU will do personally, in your opinion, after looking at all the rates and coverages – do you think more people will pay the $250 fine for the year, rather than pay the $250 a month for coverage. Then wait until they get sick to purchase coverage, or in the event of a sudden accident just continue to do what the uninsured have done in prior years.

  9. Michael says:


    I hope I handle the Scriptures properly and I work hard to do so…but my “expertise” in other fields is limited to skateboarding and drug cartels. 🙂

  10. Mohler is not a pastor. He is the president of a seminary. As far as authority goes, he’s just a guy with a blog, and lots of opinions. Like you, and me.

    The article that got you angry – I liked two of the books, don’t like one, and never heard of the other. Again, opinions. LHT, Mohler, You, me.. we all got ’em. No big deal.

  11. Ricky Bobby says:

    “Mohler is not a pastor.”

    Agreed, he is no pastor.

  12. Michael says:


    Personally, I will find a way to purchase coverage.
    In my opinion…and after running the numbers on basic family plans as well…my guess is that most will pay the fine and hope for the best.
    That is my honest opinion based on many years of not only buying insurance, but helping others do the same.
    The issue I want to see addressed immediately is the huge disparity in plan prices for similar services…that is going to confuse many people who try to get insured.

  13. Xenia says:

    Josh, I bet we liked, didn’t like, and never heard of the exact same four books!

  14. Michael says:

    We can’t actually purchase anything yet…the system is too buggy.
    They hope to get it fixed before the end of the month….

  15. Liked – Foster, Deere
    Disliked – Warren
    Never heard of – Uhhh, the other one. I can’t remember what it was.

  16. Steve Wright says:

    my guess is that most will pay the fine and hope for the best.
    I too have no doubt that will be the case. It seems the most logical conclusion knowing human behavior and the financial realities of the costs. $250 a year is less than $250 a month (even after subsidy)

    And if that DOES come to pass the whole thing comes collapsing down. It is dependent on millions of healthy young people paying into the system for coverage – not just the income from the fines.

    Of course, they can always raise the fines even quicker than currently legislated as a greater “incentive”

    Thanks again for sharing.

  17. Ricky Bobby says:

    Steve Right said, “And if that DOES come to pass the whole thing comes collapsing down. It is dependent on millions of healthy young people paying into the system for coverage – not just the income from the fines.

    Of course, they can always raise the fines even quicker than currently legislated as a greater “incentive””

    Agreed, that seems to be the case with the ACA and the dynamic we’re facing. It doesn’t look like it will turn out too well, but time will tell. I am actually beginning to think it’s a Trojan Horse of sorts…kind of like 0bama saving Wall Street. The stock market is at all-time highs and seems to love 0bamacare….maybe it’s because the reality is that the poor and young and single are going to get fined or have to pay for insurance which will benefit the Big Corp. System more.

  18. Michael says:


    I’ve managed younger employees for years…and trying to convince them to buy health insurance has always been a losing battle.
    They are simply not interested until they have children.

  19. Steve Wright says:

    The fact that Obama granted a one-year delay on the employer mandate and yet has refused to the point of shutting down the government a similar one-year delay for the individual mandate tells us all we need to know about where his concerns lie – and they lie with big business over the poor, uninsured individual.

    The problem is that the individual mandate and the subsidy eligibility is directly connected to the employer mandate – so at least for the year 2014 there will be no enforcement mechanism, no possible way of verifying if what the people claim about their eligibility is true. Here is a story on it. http://www.forbes.com/sites/theapothecary/2013/07/06/not-qualified-for-obamacares-subsidies-just-lie-govt-to-use-honor-system-without-verifying-your-eligibility/

    A summary quote:

    Politics ain’t beanbag, they say. But deliberately encouraging tens of billions of dollars of waste, fraud, and abuse in order to achieve a political objective is profoundly immoral. It’s a breach of faith with the hard-working taxpayers whose paychecks are being harnessed to a cause many of them don’t support.

  20. Steve Wright says:

    I’ve managed younger employees for years…and trying to convince them to buy health insurance has always been a losing battle.
    Imagine if you were the one SELLING it. 🙂

    (Another reason why I got out of that line of business)

  21. Michael says:

    One more thing…
    At least in Oregon you can’t compare the plans from the website (another glitch).
    You have to do that research on your own…and good luck with that.

  22. Steve Wright says:

    You have to do that research on your own…and good luck with that.
    And not only are you a very intelligent individual, but totally at ease in using the internet.

    Compare your skills and intelligence to the average population. If a guy like YOU is confused….

  23. Michael says:


    It took me three hours of searches last night just to come up with a couple reasonable comparisons…and that was because the providers had the plans on a website.
    The one thing I find inexcusable is that this state was unable to build a simple storefront with the time and money available…and what they do have up will be unusable for the average consumer.
    I’m already getting calls and emails for help in navigating it.

  24. Jim says:


  25. Solomon Rodriguez says:

    I say we get Stan “The Lariat” Hansen in as President and Michael “P.S.” Hayes as the Vice

  26. Solomon Rodriguez says:

    I’m gonna go work out now so bye bye to all my buddies here in Computer Land!! Need to take good care of myself cuz I sure ain’t gonna be purchasing no Obama Care!

  27. j2theperson says:

    I’ve heard of Nietzsche, Marx, Freud, and Darwin, but the other 4 guys? I’ve only heard of Rick Warren, and I’ve never read any of his books or listened to him talk or anything.

  28. Wow,
    I grew up on Tom Clancy books.

  29. Jim says:

    “It will be of little avail to the people that the laws are made by men of their own choice if the laws be so voluminous that they cannot be read, or so incoherent that they cannot be understood.”
    ― James Madison

  30. Jim says:

    “I cannot undertake to lay my finger on that article of the Constitution which granted a right to Congress of expending, on objects of benevolence, the money of their constituents.”
    ― James Madison

  31. Jim says:

    “The powers delegated by the proposed Constitution to the federal government are few and defined. Those which are to remain in the State governments are numerous and indefinite. The former will be exercised principally on external objects, as war, peace, negotiation and foreign commerce. … The powers reserved to the several States will extend to all the objects which in the ordinary course of affairs, concern the lives and liberties, and properties of the people, and the internal order, improvement and prosperity of the State.”
    ― James Madison

  32. “Shampoo is better. I go on first and clean the hair. Conditioner is better. I leave the hair silky and smooth. Oh, really, fool? Really. Stop looking at me, swan.”
    ― Billy Madison

  33. Oh, wait a minute. Wrong Madison.

  34. Kevin H says:

    This should clear everything up in regards to Obamacare/ACA. 🙂

  35. Xenia says:

    Madison also believed that only white male landowners should have the right to vote.

  36. Jim says:

    It’s not tyranny we desire; it’s a just, limited, federal government.
    Alexander Hamilton

  37. Scott says:

    Thanks for providing this info. I wasn’t trying to slight you when I posed the question. You are the only person I know who publicly stated you were going to sign up for it. In fact, I think you indicated your doctor encouraged you to do it. I thought it would be good to have a real life example of the process and outcome from someone with your background and experience with finances break it down. As I suspected, there is no panacea in this deal.

  38. Jim says:

    Do not separate text from historical background. If you do, you will have perverted and subverted the Constitution, which can only end in a distorted, bastardized form of illegitimate government.
    -James Madison

  39. L;utheran says:

    Kevin H,


    The Kimmel video is depressing and funny at the same time.

    ObamaCare and ACA ARE THE SAME THING!!

    ObamaCare=”I’m agin’ it

    ACA=”I’m in favor of it”

    Some people, like these low-information folk, maybe shouldn’t vote.

  40. Steve Wright says:

    That Kimmel clip is a classic example of bias because while it is true that people will say they prefer the ACA over Obamacare, people will ALSO say they prefer Obamacare over the ACA. CNBC just did a poll showing this. http://www.cnbc.com/id/101064954

    In other words, the ignorance swings both ways.

    So watch that clip, and other than the one stammering black guy at about 1:48, EVERY example Kimmel’s team picked was making people look stupid just the one direction. Which defies the odds, especially in liberal Hollywood

    Leno would have been equal in his mocking both sides….and thus funnier. 🙂

  41. David sloane says:

    Seems like this thing is convoluted and confusing by design like the tax code. Me thinks Ricky Bobby nailed it. Big corp somehow will come out ahead. Nothing to see here…move along…

  42. brian says:

    I pay about two hundred fifty per month on top of the 600 my employer pays and my deductible is 3500 per year. If you go to the emergency room it is guaranteed 5K and that is on the low side. My copay is 30$. When I had my heart HP issue I refused an ambulance which I will not call no matter what is it would easy go past 8K and that is on the low side. Personally I have just decided to die if it gets to one of those points because I will not leave debt. Personally I dont go to the doctor to much any more I do my best to take care of my health but needing medical care is just not an option for many people. People often say its not about money, I beg to differ, it is always about money, always and in every circumstance.

  43. Solomon Rodriguez says:


    But those were the Good ole days, when white males got all the privileges. See, we were a Christian country back then! Awe shucks! I miss those days

  44. Anon says:

    Greg Laurie is reporting tha Pastor Chuck died this morning.

  45. Jim says:


    The only participant here who sounds remotely racist is yourself.

  46. CrucifiED says:

    Wow, Chuck’s wikipedia page has already been updated with his death. That didn’t take long.

  47. I may have disagreed with a lot of what take place in the CC movement but Chuck infused biblical principles and a lve for Christ into a bunch of love struck free wheeling hippies

  48. To all tho are still affiliated and will miss ChuckSr, my thoughts are with you during this time of grief

  49. Nonnie says:

    Praying for God’s comfort an peace upon the Smith family.

  50. Xenia says:

    Memory eternal.

  51. Pastor Chuck Smith Of Calvary Chapel Costa Mesa
    has passed away:

  52. Oops…didn’t see that it was already reported here.

  53. Solomon Rodriguez says:


    The only participant here who sounds remotely racist is yourself.”

    Back that up with facts Jimbo. I’m a Graham Cracker brotha, Half White Half Chicano

  54. Jim says:

    Sol… we were a British colony. Do you use the term “Spanish male privilege” regarding South America? It’s really time to move on and become the “human” race.

  55. millard75 says:

    “Sol… we were a British colony. Do you use the term “Spanish male privilege” regarding South America? It’s really time to move on and become the “human” race.”

    Jim agreed! Just made the point because many conservatives gloss about the good ole days and just letting folks know that the good ole days were not so good after all

  56. Jim says:

    Meanwhile, back in America…

    Said a senior administration official: “We are winning…It doesn’t really matter to us” how long the shutdown lasts “because what matters is the end result.”


  57. Jim says:

    Obamacare Poster Boy Chad Henderson and His Dad Didn’t Really Buy Insurance


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