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  1. Paul A. Lytton says:

    This is my personal rant. Just skip it if it is to long for you to read, or if you are not interested .

    I wonder why there is no evidence of any organization/group of authority publishing an agenda to legally identify the difference between Protesting and looting? We already have laws against looting. Why have they been allowed to come under the guise of ‘protesting’? Surely it can not be because law enforcement is afraid to enforce the law which they know clearly.

    The only un-clear factor I can think of in this manner is that it happens under a false pretense of being a part of a large amount of citizens collectively; while law enforcement is unable to tell the difference between the two separate groups, by physical, individual, identity. That being said, law enforcement is failing to do their job to protect the innocent citizens against an obvious, vicious attack coming from malicious thugs.

    Even worse than that (in my opinion) is that it is being allowed to continue by an overwhelming amount of citizens (the majority). The majority of citizens have failed because they have developed a weakness after becoming accustom to others (including the government) to do things for them instead of being satisfied with what God provides. The thugs have always been in the mindset of ‘do it yourself’, regardless of the outcome.

    This is where the answer to the problem should be routed from.

    When the disregard of the circumstance is embedded, the warrior is at his/her strongest point and stays focused only on achieving the goal. The majority (especially of Christians) in this country have lacked the courage to utilize this type of warrior-ship for the purpose of defending what is right.

    They have lost confidence in fighting for what is right in God’s determination, therefore giving more power to man’s rightfulness.

    Because there are many different types of people, there are many types of man rights. This is an automatic birth of ‘right’ diversities. This is even so where there are more than one gods. All Christians believe in the one and only righteous God, but they failed by focusing on themselves to be the one defining God’s ways instead of merely following God’s instructions. Does the title Pharisee come to mind here, it should.

    This world belongs to two entities: 1.) The physical, man 2.) The spiritual, Satan.

    Thugs rejoice in attempting to appease the two. This is the goal they fight for as warriors.

    True Christians should be warriors against appeasing the two as being their goal. The Christian will never win the battle of the worldly right because there is no worldly right and that is not his/her job. The Christian job is too spread the word of the true God for the purpose of informing the world that there actually is a righteous goal to be reached.

    Christians can not change the thug, but they can inform them of the truly righteous. The choice belongs to everyone.
    The consequences’ belong to everyone also. Make a choice between having a worldly goal or an after death goal and be a warrior towards that goal.

    God bless you,

  2. John 20:29 says:

    “True Christians should be warriors against appeasing the two as being their goal. The Christian will never win the battle of the worldly right because there is no worldly right and that is not his/her job. The Christian job is too spread the word of the true God for the purpose of informing the world that there actually is a righteous goal to be reached.”
    i think thatGman began the comments on the preceeding thread with a succinct summary of your thoughts, Paul L.
    it seems our problem is lack of wisdom, lack of discernment – things that God has supplied to those who seek Him in abundance and yet…
    we do try to tweek God into our world view and, come to think of it, that’s a very dangerous route to go… it produces things like ISIS

    God keep us all and keep us on track through these now troubled waters

  3. Scooter Jones says:

    Well, if you have a spare 3 hrs, you can watch the whole prayer service here 😉

  4. Scooter Jones says:

    Greg Laurie’s prayer is at the 2:36 mark, right after the Muslim cleric’s prayer to allah 😉

  5. Jean says:

    What is an interfaith service? A religion buffet? Sounds like an abomination.

  6. Michael says:


    I posted that for MLD…so he can tell us that it’s an abomination. 🙂

  7. nathan priddis says:

    Still trying to process hearing Greg Laurie’s voice this AM. Can’t help wondering what the non-believing population would think of learning who Lonnie Frisbee was.

    It’s a long way from Pirate’s Cove to D.C. baby.

  8. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    I went and check out the list of spiritual performers just to be sure that the Lutherans were staying true to the faith and not showing up.
    Lutherans are forbidden by doctrine to be in interfaith shows. It was good to see that no Lutherans, not even from the liberal sides broke that one (they may allow homosexuals and women to be pastors, but know to draw the line before turning into the prophets of Baal – all calling out to their own gods)

    Actually Lutherans are required to stay away from all form of unionism and syncretism – which is both not praying with those with heterodox beliefs or those with non Christian beliefs.

    So look what happened today was all those religious ministers got up and led people to think that they were all praying to the same god – which actually they may have been … just not the God of the Bible

  9. Anon says:

    “In earlier coverage of Trump’s clergy lineup for the ceremony, Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary professor John D. Wilsey noted Trump’s willingness to outsource “God talk” to affiliated leaders from the faith community.

    “Trump wants to communicate to religious people (Jews and Christians) that he speaks their language, and he does so by associating with leaders that have a large following or that represent significant segments of the religious population,” Wilsey said.”

    Translation: Trump doesn’t walk the walk. But close enough — he’s gonna usher in utopia.

    What an abomination.

  10. Linnea says:

    Anon at 10….what if Trump is a young believer? He may be a billionaire, but untested in the world of Christianity. Can we afford him the same latitude we allow new believers?

  11. John 20:29 says:

    one thing i noted, Trump’s mother had given him a Bible long years ago and he’s kept it all the years – he obviously hasn’t used it much or it would be falling apart…
    so the very least we as Believers can do is stand in her stead and pray for her son… long years ago, i was on my knees praying for my children when i heard a voice as clear as day say, if you love your children, pray for S— unbeknown to me at that moment, the daughter of some very dear friends was being rushed to the hospital
    as a result, all these years, it has lain on my heart that i am selfish to pray for my children when other Believers’ children may need my prayers added also

    just sayin … cuz i can

    it occurs to me that we do have an O.T. example of an interfaith prayer service…
    what i want is an inter-faith prayer service where a N.T. Elijah shows up 🙂

  12. covered says:

    Well said Linnea. I wonder how many visitors to this site would confuse us for Christians? There’s no shortage of vitriol filled comments. I didn’t find this site till July of ’09 but I wonder how much hate speech followed our last President when he got elected.

  13. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    My comments were not political or about who Trump hangs with. My thoughts were that all the participating hot shot pastors were not doing God’s will.

    Even those who say, “well, they prayed in Jesus name” do not understand that in the perceived world that all roads lead to Rome – you get to the same god by praying in your guy’s name.
    So the christian prays in Jesus name
    The Muslim in Allah’s name, the Hindu in Buddha’s name, the Mormon in Joseph Smith’s name, the Native American in Sitting Bull’s name, the Wicca in Harry Potter’s name and it goes on and on into false teaching.

  14. Michael says:


    There was a lot of vitriol both times…the explosion of social media has turned that up exponentially.

  15. Xenia says:

    Actually, the Mormon “apostle” gave the best prayer of all as he gave a pretty accurate description of the Trinity, which he characterized as “one God.”

    Archbishop Demerits of the Greek Archdiocese offered a very short prayer. This is against our rules, too.

  16. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    and since we know that the Mormon Church has an alternative view to the Christian faith, I will repeat that these so called ‘regular ‘protestant pastors gave the illusion that Mormonism is both Triune and Christian – and it is neither.

  17. Jean says:


    Are you saying that I don’t need these:

  18. Well they may be warmer than your tighty whities. 🙂

  19. Jean says:


  20. John 20:29 says:

    pray for the LDS crowd… who knows what God can do? are we there yet? nope, but pray

  21. JM says:

    Nathan – “Can’t help wondering what the non-believing population would think of learning who Lonnie Frisbee was.”

    If you know who Paul Cain is, and the video on the link I am giving is true, there are even more questions we should ask about the influences upon Chuck Smith and how they affected him as CC was coming together.

  22. nathan priddis says:


    I am not sure about the accuracy of his account. I have some pretty complex thoughts of the whole CC history. Lonnie went to the National Prayer Breakfast, and his student is praying before the President this AM.

    On another thought. In the early 2000’s or so, I heard John Courson mentioning how we can’t judge people on the outward behavioral appearance. (paraphrasing here) He went on to mention an old preacher who was an alcoholic, and living as an elderly down-n- outer. But he was described as a spiritual giant, or some such thing. A higher level Christian.

    In fairly recent discussions of Frisbee, the comment came to memory. I would if he was referring to Cain, and had been introduced by CS, or told of him by CS.

    This much I know, as I watch the World around me many scriptures come to mind. But that’s another matter.

  23. JM says:


    I wish there was a way to finally verify the statements made by Cain in the video. Cain is supposed to still be alive and living somewhere in California (central?). It would be good to get an interview. Either that or talk to Courson and get him to give a name. Frankly, Cain is likely spiritually unclean. (His rallies would some times be followed by EMF interruptions, etc., which are phenomena of the occult.) It would be frightening to think Chuck worked for him and supported him at one time. However, Chuck was not always forthcoming about a lot of things, nor did he cop to his mistakes when it came to Kuhlman or Frisbee. He was found to lie about more than a few things and even rationalized away the seriousness of the sins of his “spiritual children” (Skippy, etc.). I would like a lot of the questions answered about CC’s origins and even the beginnings of some of the “originals” who have been proffered as true miracles. I have never been comfortable with the testimonies of some who “came to Christ” because of a “vision” they had while on an acid trip. One of the ones with that testimony was Lonnie Frisbee. Another one came out of Timothy Leary’s cult and eventually became a sort of hatchet man at CC for awhile. His purpose was to keep the unwashed masses at bay when they would go to him and complain about the horrors perpetrated by the self-centered Moses adherents…oh…did I say that outloud?…I meant pastors. I think he fell, but gained another pastorate eventually. Can we see a pattern here?

    I see no requirement to check discernment at the door in the face of all that we know nor to be oblivious to all the bad fruit that we keep seeing from this entity. I think of a lot of Scriptures, too. One comes to mind a lot lately. It tells me to be “wise as a serpent”.

    I have been waiting 40 years for some things to come out. If you were there in the Pirate’s Cove Days, maybe you have been waiting longer. I don’t know. If, indeed, you are still seeking answers, I hope you get them.

  24. nathan priddis says:


    “… I hope you get them.” Thank you. I am making a lot of progress towards that goal, but in a disorganized way. I am looking back over my life and trying to piece together some answer to the question..what the hell? Being a believer since early childhood can be described as confusing and disturbing. But at least some things are beginning to make sense now about the groups I have been around. I am finding some very fascinating things.

    I am to young for Pirates Cove. But it sounds like you are closer to that time frame. I don’t recall if you mentioned your first introduction to CC.

  25. JM says:

    Nathan, it is good to read your feedback. There was a time when I deeply wished that I had grown up with the Christian gospel so that I could have entered into adulthood that way. However, I have seen that those who grew up that way can still struggle because of so many teachings constantly competing for attention, not to mention a great deal that’s inappropriate is allowed to pass in the name of church. It’s a minefield on a good day.

    My journey to Christ actually began in late 1973, when one of their proselytes witnessed to me. I was not in a position to go to the baptisms in Pirate’s Cove until 1979. Long story. I’m not sure where that puts my on any timeline. I have long since assumed that what I saw and experienced was after most of the glory had faded because sin had begun to fester in the camp. Unfortunately, it took another 40 years for people to get that memo.

  26. Josh the Baptist says:

    A couple of weeks ago I asked about Theology books and got some great input here, so I’ll try this again:

    Has anyone thought much about the relation of “Day of the Lord” as used in the Old Testament, vs. Paul usage of the phrase?

  27. Jean says:


    As a highly trained Pharisee and OT scholar, I assume that Paul uses the term with the same meaning as in the OT, except that he recognizes Jesus as the Lord.

    It is my understanding that “Day of the Lord” refers to a day of judgment associated with theophany, but this is just off the cuff.

  28. Josh the Baptist says:

    Thanks Jean.

  29. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    I agree with Jean’s cuff

  30. Josh the Baptist says:

    Wow – Who would have thought there is a wikipedia page dedicated to this exact question: 🙂

    I do appreciate any comments, maybe even a general description of wht The Day of the Lord is.

  31. Josh the Baptist says:

    Wait – maybe if I narrow this down it will help. Look at “Day of the Lord” Joel 2:31, vs. “Day of the Lord” 1 Thes. 5:2.

    Same thing? How do they relate, etc.?

  32. Michael says:


    Robert Van Kampen did some excellent work on the Day of the Lord…same thing as the Second Coming/Rapture.

    I’ll try to find a link for you…

  33. Josh the Baptist says:

    I’ll google it Michael. Thanks so much for the lead.

  34. Josh the Baptist says:

    Perfect Michael. That article is written by Roger Best…name sounds familiar. Is there a reason I know that name?

  35. Josh the Baptist says:

    Nevermind. Just figured it out. I was thinking of Harold Best, and mixing that with Roger Oakland. 🙂

  36. Michael says:

    Alan Kurschner has a lot of stuff up on his site as well…

  37. Jean says:

    On this day we celebrate the Conversion of St. Paul.

    “Jesus confronts Saul and converts him through the Gospel and Baptism. Though Saul was convinced of his righteous mission of persecution, he learned that true righteousness comes only through Christ. The Holy Spirit opened Saul’s eyes and heart to forgiveness through Christ so he boldly confessed His name to his fellow Jews. Due to Saul’s past, Christians are suspicious of him. Due to his new faith, enemies of the Christian faith plot to kill him. Nevertheless, the Holy Spirit brings Saul to other believers who help him escape. Through the power of the Gospel, the Church continues to grow. . . .

    All we are and all we do depends on His blessing and calling. Trust that the Lord is able to change people’s lives—even people you regard as utterly lost and despicable. How great is our Lord and His grace! For the sake of the Gospel, support and defend the witness of your brothers and sisters in Christ. The Lord your Savior is your defender. The Lord will likewise watch over the future of your congregation. Proclaim Christ! The Savior will bless and keep you.”

    Devotion is taken from Lutheran Bible Companion, Volume 2, pages 375–76, 397 © 2014 Concordia Publishing House. All rights reserved.

  38. em ... again says:

    Mary Tyler Moore – may she rest in peace – how i wish our youngsters’ role models today were as classy…

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