Take and Eat…

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43 Responses

  1. Michael says:

    This went over about as well as I expected it too…perhaps I should post excerpts from the Elijah List proclaiming the coming triumph by Trump over evil…

  2. Muff Potter says:

    Trump is over with.
    His swan song will become as part of the American experience as ‘Oh Susanna’.

  3. bob1 says:

    Sounds excellent. I really resonate with the quote. This isn’t an easy topic to broach, and it sounds like the author has handled it deftly. Definitely will see if our library system has it!

  4. DavidP says:

    This is down the list (as modern evangelical books go I need to finish Russel Moore and KSP first), but I enjoy Kaitlyn on the Holy Post. I can tell I am WAY outside of the “Christian Nationalism” realms (and remember a ton of this debate back in the 90s when it was called Christian Identity or Christian Patriotism) but knowing how seriously some people take it, it’s good to have refreshers for the current generations.

    And…tell me one cool thing about Chuck Berry we didn’t know.

  5. Michael says:

    Muff, I hope you’re right…but I’m not so sure.

  6. Michael says:


    It’s excellent…I think you’ll appreciate it.

  7. Michael says:


    I should write up both the books you named…prophetic voices both.

    If you were a fan of Chuck Berry, you already know most of what’s in the bio…unfortunately, I knew he was a difficult man, but I had no idea he was a pretty morally sick fellow as well…

  8. Linn says:

    I think at some point the Republican Party will implode because it just won’t be viable anymore. Or, they will have to ditch Trump, which I don’t see happening. They idolize him.

    I’ll put the book in my list. I sympathize-I always have more books around than I ever get to read!

  9. Captain Kevin says:

    Great quote! I have no book budget currently, but I look forward to future reviews with quotes.

  10. Muff Potter says:

    I believe you’re right.
    The Republican Party IS NOT the party of Dwight Eisenhower and Ronald Reagan, and it hasn’t been for a number of years now.
    It’s been taken over by far-right radicals who don’t want a Democracy.

  11. Alan says:

    Does Kaitlyn have anything good to say about the church and her use of the Bible?

  12. Michael says:


    Really rude question and a solid indicator that you haven’t read the book.

    It’s probably the best and most balanced book of it’s kind balancing history and theology…with an obvious love of both Scripture and the church.

    Read it and I’ll forward your apology…

  13. Alan says:

    Wasn’t rude …but it was suspicious. The discussion does not deserve less.

  14. Michael says:


    Because I liked it?

    The discussion deserves people reading something before spouting knee jerk fears that one of their pyrite calves might be slain.

    I actually like to read things that challenge my preconceptions.

    She was educated at Dallas Theological Seminary…not exactly a bastion of liberal thought.

    Every day I get closer to hanging up my skates…I simply don’t understand anymore.

  15. Alan says:

    When I referenced the discussion I meant only the comments that are on this thread.

  16. Michael says:


    My job as I have understood it was to help people think biblically.

    This book addresses one area where Christians need to learn to think, period.

    If your offense was at pointed remarks about the Republican Party…I see them echoed by Republicans mourning the takeover of their party by extremists and representatives that you would normally only encounter in a trailer park known for drug use.

    In any case, these are not my concerns…my concerns are a (futile) effort to see us educate ourselves above rhetoric that will soon end us all.

    Hopefully, someone will soon bemoan the state of the Democratic Party so we can actually address the reason I wrote the article.

  17. Michael says:

    Completely off the trail…one of my frustrations is that I personally would consider voting Republican if they would put forth a sane candidate that isn’t a maniacal narcissist or afraid of the same.

    “Progressive” policies have made my state a hell hole…mainly because they will never admit to a mistake and the good they’ve done is at risk of being swallowed by the darkness.

    So…please don’t assume who or what I’m about until you ask.

    The present system is broken, probably permanently…so I’ll go back to trying to teach those who will listen.

  18. Alan says:

    I have just revisited Jeremiah, Ezekiel, Daniel, Habakuk, Zephaniah and Obadiah. I am pretty sure they have us sized up well.

    I did at least ask about the book.

  19. Michael says:


    I hope you plan on teaching what you have learned…as always, I’m all ears.

  20. Alan says:


    I appreciate that. Neither of us will likely have a reasonable opportunity to change.

    Our system is broken we agree and madmen are all we have to choose.

  21. Alan says:

    I am going to Brazil and Paraguay to teach what I am learning in November. Until then I am reading and grading papers and spend most days alone. Very pleasant.

  22. Michael says:

    Sounds like a pretty good life…I’d add cats of course… 🙂

  23. Alan says:


    The Christian Nationalism movement is splitting, those who believe in a divine covenant, those who want a national constitutional convention and those who want some kind on acknowledgment that our liberal democracy was simply founded christian. But it is splitting big time. Plus many conservatives like myself are rejecting it out of hand in all of its forms as idolatry and pagan.

    I did not mean to diminish her work … as usual if you and I can bark we can avoid the bite. Anyway her long book will not likely find its way to my list. I am already persuaded and have too much to read like you said in your post.

    Also I just bought my granddaughter another cat, the last one I got her escaped and likely became coyote sustenance. Her name is Pearl, a big time purrer …

  24. Michael says:


    It seemed to me to be splitting, but I’m glad to have some confirmation.

    I can’t keep up with such things…life is complex and difficult enough, but I do not want to be totally ignorant, either.

    Bless you for being an indulgent grampa…may the Lord give your granddaughter and Pearl many happy years together…

  25. Janet Linn, BrideofChrist says:

    I may agree with Muff Potter that ‘Trump is over with’. I’m stting now looking over Lake Tholocco in a cabin on Fort Rucker in Alabama. Our son-in-law trains Army soldiers how to do rescue missions on Blackhawk helicopters here. Last night we had a long discussion about how many formerly Republican-leaning enlisted members have no intention of voting for Trump again. He definitely has shown no respect for the Armed Forces. Trump has alienated so many different groups of Americans I don’t understand how anyone ever expects that Trump could possibly get enough votes to win in 2024.

  26. Alan says:

    And of his increase and government there shall be no end…

  27. Pineapple Head says:

    I’m reading a book that just came out called FAITHFUL EXILES. It’s a series of essays that challenges the reader to not think in terms of fight or flight, but as being thoughtful and intentional as we are faithful and obedient to our Creator. All in all, I appreciate what I’ve read because the authors sound like grown ups to me. Which is something lacking in our culture.

  28. Muff Potter says:

    I have no illusions that America was founded as a ‘Christian’ nation.
    In the Bible, there is no such thing as ‘The Rights of Man’ (Thomas Paine).
    You (generic you) were at the whim and fancy of some autocrat or another, up to, and including the Big Kahuna in the sky.
    America was founded with ideas from the Enlightenment thinkers.
    I’m convinced that if ‘Christian Nationalists’ ever accrued the power they crave, it would be as brutal a dictatorship as any the world has seen.

  29. DavidP says:

    I knew some of the gross things about Berry, but it’s rather distressing to know just how much was going on. Between Berry, Elvis getting drafted and Little Richard converting, plus Jerry Lee Lewis’s own scandals, it’s a miracle Rock and Roll wasn’t just a small blip.

    Incidentally, I just reread Michael Spencer’s “Coming Evangelical Collapse,” after reading an article in the AP about the “nones.” Spencer’s essay should be framed. 15 years later and any of the 3 books mentioned feels like they’re all hitting on some of the same issues.

  30. Alan says:

    You guys are whistling past the grave yard. The totalitarians are deeply ensconced and you’re worried about a whimpering movement that has no teeth. The left wing controls virtually everything. Since 2020 that influence has made inroads into the last bastions the military and the police. We will be under total left wing control like California and you guys will still be worrying that Jerry Falwell like Nero is gonna rise up in the east and conquer all.

  31. Michael says:


    Raw talent and the lack of social media allowed rock and roll to thrive in that time.

    Michael Spencer was a prophet…I regret that he and I did not reconcile before his death…

  32. DavidP says:

    Man oh man, do I wish Trump was “over with” again. However the past few months have reminded us that if this one is struck down there will be 7 others ready to move in.

    We’re in a populist age. Iconoclasts are begging to be our saviors.

  33. Michael says:


    I live in Oregon…as far left as you can go without falling in the Pacific.

    As I said earlier the failed programs of progressive politics are finally starting to be rejected by its own base.

    While some programs have been a great success (Medicaid) many have almost made the state unlivable. I suspect that if sane conservatives would run here, they could capture the state.

    As long as conservatives cling to Trump…we will not change even when necessary.

  34. Michael says:


    Who are the authors involved…we may need to pitch it…

  35. Michael says:

    By the way…the Scheiss book isn’t about left and right…it’s about how we use the Bible in politics.

    Small book…you’ll learn much.

  36. Pineapple Head says:

    Mostly names unknown to me. The only authors I recognize are Jay Kim (who wrote ANALOG CHURCH) and Brett McCracken. One thing I noticed is a 4 of the essay writers do not live in the U.S. or have lived abroad doing missions work. Which I find helpful. Sometimes getting out of America is a great way to gain a better perspective of America. I’ll just list the names of the contributors”

    Ivan Mesa and Elliot Clark, General Editors
    Essayists: Claude Atcho, Alex Duke, Keri Folmar, Megan Hill, Jay Kim, Blair Linne, Ken Mbugua, Stephen McAlpine, Brett McCraken, Shane Morris, Jairo Nammun, Miguel Nunez, Glen Scrivener.

    From the back of the book:

    How do we live by faith when we’re far from home?

    Our world is rapidly changing. In the West, Christians increasingly are strangers in a strange land. Biblical values are maligned. Christian ethics are called hateful. How should the church respond? Is now the time for cultural isolation, political aggression, or something else? What are the options for heaven’s exiles living in an earthly Babylon?

    More than a simple fight-or-flight response, the authors of Faithful Exiles offer us hope when we’re far from home. Gleaning courage and insight from biblical characters in both the Old and New Testaments, they consider how God’s people through the ages have been faithful in the face of hostility. Their stories inform our worship and preaching but also how we pursue vocation and engage in politics. They show how those with hope beyond this world can be faithful in it.

  37. Pineapple Head says:

    Here’s a paragraph from the forward of FAITHFUL EXILES:

    We don’t need to panic when we see segments of society being overrun by forces hostile to Christianity. Deeper than the world history we see, there’s another history unfolding. God is working out his plan for his creation, and nothing can thwart it. The final victory, of which the resurrection is the firstfruits, will surely come in God’s timing. We’re living in the period between the firstfruits and the consummation. If we realized this, we wouldn’t compromise our principles and accommodate oursleves to this present world. Neither would we use unbiblical methods to combat wrong. Our confidence in God enables us to stick within the parameters of Christian belief and practice.

  38. Michael says:


    I’ll put it on the pile…sounds needful…

  39. Pineapple Head says:

    Michael, you are in Oregon, which often leans liberal in regard to politics and social issues.

    I’m in North Idaho, which leans hard right. As in HARD right. And many of our churches are happy to make such conservative politics central to their “ministries.” It’s painful to watch the arrogance, judgementalism, and condescension that is exhibited by those who are indeed called to truth, but also called to love. Many of these people lack a theology of suffering and persecution. They get swept up in the fervor of going back to the good old days and taking things back for Jesus. The millenials and Gen Zers in my church find all of this appalling.

  40. Michael says:


    This is a really hard time to be a Bible teacher…you’re going to have extremes on both sides and some folks in the middle getting beat up by both sides. Bless you for trying just to teach what is written…I pray you have strength to continue…

  41. Alan says:

    If our churches had a more vibrant kingdom theology they would not be swept away by these political narratives. However, if you cross the entire world you will find that nationalism in the church has often been the impetus of fast growth. So this ideology has to be confronted over and over.

    Kingdom theology is universal encompassing all of mankind, Kingdom theology fears no government, expects no princely favor, has no racial rivals, frets no temporal loss. Kingdom theology confronts the powers armed only with faith in our king and faithfulness in our blood. Kingdom theology lives in the power of a river that flows from the throne. It has no need to establish a throne. Kingdom theology is in the Holy Spirit. It breathes no threats but endures the withering blast of the dragon’s flood of lies.

    Kingdom theology is in Christ. Wherever the king so goes the kingdom. Her citizens are familiar with the robe dipped in blood. They follow the lamb wherever he goes. That is why there is always a harlot church masquerading as a bride. Be not deceived.

  42. Michael says:


    I concur…we may differ on some details, but I affirm what you wrote here.

  43. Captain Kevin says:

    Piney and Alan, you’ve both shared some really insightful words.

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