Things I Think…

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219 Responses

  1. Jean says:


    Regarding your #5, have you ever heard of Dominion Covenant or Dominion Theology? I just learned that this is a new or newer doctrine being taught in some American Christian circles and wondering if you are aware of it or whether it’s becoming widespread.

    It goes hand in hand with your concern expressed in #5, but seeks to provide a scriptural basis.

  2. Michael says:


    There are two separate and unrelated strains using something akin to “dominion theology”.
    One is popular in the “new apostolic reformation”… and goes under various titles like “seven mountain” theology.
    The other is Christian Deconstructionism” sired by Rushdooney.
    Of the two, the “seven mountain” pile is higher…

  3. Em says:

    #5 says a lot IMV
    John 18:36 comes to mind… that and our role in this world described as an Ambassador for Christ’s Kingdom. ARE we representing The Faith accurately? Hmmmm…..
    Is the wolf population increasing among us?

  4. Em says:

    I hope the erudite among us here (not me) will give Dominion theology a good airing for the benefit of us all…

  5. Duane Arnold says:


    This seems to be a pretty good overview…

  6. Jean says:


    From the article:

    “In his article entitled ‘Dominionism Rising’ published on the Political Research site, Frederick Clarkson explains that ‘Dominionism is the theocratic idea that regardless of theological camp, means, or timetable, God has called conservative Christians to exercise dominion over society by taking control of political and cultural institutions. The term describes a broad tendency across a wide swath of American Christianity.’ “

    Imagine my surprise when yesterday, on an orthodox Christian FB page a regular contributor espoused this. He also used the term “Re-reformed.”

    It reminds me of the claim Eric Trump made a couple weeks ago that his father saved Christianity.

  7. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    So there are about 200 million people in the US who claim to be Christians. How many align with Dominion Theology? How many have even heard of it or can pronounce it.
    So, it got mentioned on a conservative website – big deal.
    Put it to the test – next time at the grocery store ask the people in the bakery section – “so, what do you think of dominion theology?

  8. EM. I was once attached to a Reconstructionist group.( Rushdooney) It was not a Spirituality, but a temporal political philosophy. It’s mostly not what it visualized as a new direction, but rather what it hated and desired to terminate.

    .Welfare and any like kind benifit program
    .Medicare/Medicaid and all Federal healthcare
    .Federal education support
    .Transition to Customs based federal revenue
    .Transition to gold backed dollars
    .Introduce death penalty for a broad swath of subgroups based on ideology, political affiliation and sexuality.
    The system is based on Scripture, from which First Principles are taken and then Derived Principles are created from the First Principles. God is a Judge and Lawgiver. This is how a human is to relate to him, by obeying his Law. (plus the Derived Principles)

  9. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    Michael, I don’t understand your #2. What will be your benchmark?
    My church will be just the same the Sunday after the election as it was the Sunday before – full of sinners meeting around word and sacrament to receive God’s grace.

  10. josh hamrick says:

    It hurts me that “conservative” now assumes something both theologically and politically. I know that in other’s eyes I am conservative, but I’ve come to detest the term.

  11. Em says:

    Thank you, Nathan…. Hmmm
    Doesn’t sound much like my brand. of The Faith….

    A FEW good secular ideas buried in a mindless misinterpretation of Christianity

  12. Michael says:


    Christian nationalism is a form of dominion theology.
    They make not be able to define it, but they do practice it.

  13. Em says:

    Josh, try substituting rational for conservative… 😁

  14. Michael says:

    As to #2…the church splits and broken relationships from the political wars will not heal after the election…we will deal with those ramifications inside and outside the church for years to come…

  15. josh hamrick says:

    Oh yeah – my previous comment was in reply to #1 . I see “good theology”, and I think, “what the heck is that?” So many of the “good theology” club have proven that their theology can change to suit political aspirations.
    I guess if one is big on Jesus, big on the Bible, big on treating others well…that’s might be good theology.

  16. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    Josh, I know many, especially I Lutheran circles who are “conservative” in their theology and moderate to liberal in their politics.
    The 2 do not need to be tied together.

  17. josh hamrick says:

    MLD – they’ve become terribly entangled. I came up with mostly theological conservatives, but that implied absolutely nothing about our politics. We could argue left-wing, right-wing, and in-between, but mostly agree theologically.

    I’m not seeing that anymore. Conservative has sort of become a dog-whistle word for me. Anytime someone spends much time describing himself in that way, I make distance between us.

  18. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    You make God and Country out to be something new in the last couple of election cycles.
    It came over on the Mayflower and has always been amongst us.

  19. Jean says:


    “Anytime someone spends much time describing himself in that way, I make distance between us.”

    I’m just guessing, but if the word, “conservative,” connoted the politics and demeanor of a man like William F. Buckley Jr. or one of the Bush father or brothers or a man like John Kasich, or Ronald Reagan, I bet you wouldn’t feel that way. But I’m guessing that that word has taken on a certain stench from the current conservative head, which most in the conservative political party have embraced almost like sheep as the paradigm, so that he has literally re-defined the word “conservative” in political parlance.

  20. josh hamrick says:

    “he has literally re-defined the word “conservative” in political parlance.”

    Maybe. And so many Conservative Christians have jumped on board, and just made a bi mess of the whole thing. But the more I think about the word, the more I hate it. What are you conserving? A way of life. A way of life that wasn’t good for a lot of other citizens.

    (That being said, I didn’t like Reagan or the Bushes, though the Bushes seemed like decent people)

  21. josh hamrick says:

    “It came over on the Mayflower and has always been amongst us.”

    Hmm. That’s the truth. Damning, but its true.

  22. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    Josh, your experience may not be mine and that’s OK.
    I can use me and Jean as example and we can see if he agrees. We are both quite conservative theologically – we subscribe to the same scriptures and confessions.
    Now politically I a quite conservative, and I do not shy away from that. Jean on the other hand not so much. If not liberal politically, to put the best construction on it, he is quite squishy. It is the rare occasion we agree.

    If we get together, which we have, we commune together and we pray together. You can differ and not divide. Those who divide are in grave sin and need to repent.

  23. Duane Arnold says:

    In my opinion, Dominion Theology and its bastard child, Christian Nationalism, are both heresies…

  24. Jean says:


    The sad thing is that when I encountered this yesterday, it wasn’t from your average kook. This guy fancies himself as learned. He even said:

    “But even the early church fathers, Eusebius, Orosius, St. Augustine of Hippo, and Bede the Venerable could see that, after Christ’s death and resurrection, history itself was changing, and getting better. The old curse of sin began losing its power.”

    This Dominion Theology sounds post-millennial too.

  25. Duane Arnold says:


    I’d love to see his references for such a statement! You would have to start by burning Augustine’s ‘City of God’….

  26. bob1 says:

    In my opinion, Dominion Theology and its bastard child, Christian Nationalism, are both heresies…


    A close friend of mine went to a conservative Reformed college in the early 80s. They studied Rushgoony in one of their classes. Back then, he was considered a kook, even in these circles.

    Sad that this crap has metastasized.

  27. bob1 says:


    That’s a special kind of stupid there from your FB friend.

    Or as the professor said of a student’s paper, “This isn’t right. It isn’t even wrong.”


  28. Jean says:


    My understanding of the history of eschatology in Western Christianity is that before the “modern” era, i.e., no one thought humanity was progressing at all.

    Then following the Renaissance and the peaking with the enlightenment, philosophers began to write about human progress, and this was taken up in theology as post-millennialism.

    However, following a number of events, including the Earthquake of Lisbon in 1755, the French Revolution, and most especially the American civil war, these put the kabash on on post-millenialism . It was replace with its polar opposite: pre-millenialism. These folks believe the world is going to hell in a handbasket and only after things get bad enough will Christ return.

    It seems like the Dominion folks have really poor and short memories.

  29. Xenia says:


    It was not a Spirituality, but a temporal political philosophy. <<<

    So true. I found myself once at a lecture given by Mr. Rushdooney and he spoke for an hour about the Mosaic Law and I don't he ever once mentioned Jesus Christ.

    This was at a homeschool convention. Maybe most of those moms and dads never heard of Dominionism or Reconstructionism but they were all planning on their kids being the country's next senators and judges. (And nothing wrong with that either, if the motives are right.) The theme of many of the workshops was "raise up your Christian kids to be the leaders of America and you can do it if you buy the curriculum I'm selling!"

    So the idea is certainly popular in many areas of Evangelicalism, even if they never heard of Mr. Rushdooney, RIP.

  30. Xenia says:

    Reconstructionism was all the rage among homeschoolers in the 90’s. Some of the biggest HS advocates were Reconstructionist Calvinists who had some really, really draconian ideas about law and order.

    An example: One very popular HS author (Mary Pride by name) wrote in one of her books that God hates divorce and that if you are divorced and remarried, you cannot, repeat CANNOT enter the Kingdom of Heaven and the only way you can fix this is to leave your 2nd husband, even if you have 6 kids with him, and go back to your first husband, even if he’s a dope addict on the street. If you can’t reunite with husband number one, you must divorce and separate from #2 and never ever marry again or it’s hell for you, sister!

    The Calvinist/Reconstructionist vs Free Will/ Calvary Chapel divide got so severe I eventually left our HS group, where I was the leader. The Pentecostals had their own dominionist ideas but I can’t say I ever really understood them as they seemed based on local prophecies and what not.

    I’ve been out of the home school loop for decades so I don’t know what’s going on with them now although I can make a few guesses.

  31. Dan from Georgia says:

    Xenia…I came across that insane marriage/divorce teaching a few years back. I tried to reason with one of them that my spouse is not safe with her ex. This person wouldn’t have any of it. i was told to “give up” my current marriage. Oh, so you ARE advocating divorce. Oh, ok, I’ll just no longer protect my wife and allow her to be abused again. Talk about breaking the bonds of marriage. Scary people.

  32. Dan from Georgia says:

    BTW…even John Piper…yes, THAT John Piper is in disagreement with that line of thought (must leave your second spouse and reunite with first spouse).

  33. bob1 says:

    Well, good for Piper.

    Sounds kinda insane to me…

  34. bob1 says:


    In our HS group/area, I don’t think we ever got to Dominionism and Reconstructionism. Although we knew some independent HSers, usually
    more charismatics, that did.

  35. Em says:

    Some reasons for divorce ARE frivolous and self serving, but there are valid reasons for leaving a spouse – does that mean that you are sentenced to go through life without a partner?
    Somehow i tink that is a case by case decision and, for a child of
    God it may take prayer, honest prayer, and perhaps some counseling…. Lot of ifs come to mnd…. I think if my spouse was involved adultery, left me for another I’d expect God to bless me with a new mate…. a good one 😇
    The catch might be how easy we rationalize…. Could i leave a faithful mate for what i viewed as a better prospect? It’s likely God wouldn’t bless that…. “richer, poorer, better or worse…” Those things we vowed at the altar. . .
    God give us strebgth, wisdom and contentment…..

  36. Nancy Holmes says:

    #10–Yup, may be time for lampstand removal… For whatever it is worth, Michael, yesterday I wrote Revelation 2:5 on my calendar after reading Peter Wehner’s article in The Atlantic.

  37. Xenia says:

    Mrs. Pride said in her book that you weren’t really divorcing your 2nd spouse because you were never married to them in the first place, you were just living in adultery. Didn’t matter if you were divorced/remarried before you became a Christian, if you were with someone other than the first person you married (having become one flesh with #1) then you are an adulterer and no adulterer goes to heaven. You must repent of your adultery and that can only be accomplished by departing the adulterous relationship, that is, your current spouse with whom you have six kids. She saw no loophole at all. If Number One was abusive, you don’t have to go live with him but you must consider him to be your husband until he dies.

  38. Xenia says:

    The Catholics have a similar idea, but they came up with the idea of annulment to get around it. They decree that you were never married to Number One to begin with, even if you have six kids with him, the marriage is annulled. This makes the children bastards, I guess, but that doesn’t seem to matter so much these days.

  39. Em says:

    Pondering Nancy’s post…..
    A late pastor teacher, who must remain nameless here, years ago taught that the Christian Church was the pivot that held this nation together and if we, the Church, failed, this nation would go down … He saw warning signs of that in the 1970s… didn’t seem possible then, but now……

  40. Xenia says:

    The Church will not, cannot fail. It is the Bride of Christ. It is the Body of Christ.

    People may fall away. People who were never Christians to begin with will shuffle off. But the Church will not fail.

  41. Dan from Georgia says:


    That is kinda what I figured was their reasoning. Funny how some people decide who gets into heaven.

  42. Xenia says:

    We were debating Mrs. Pride’s book at a HS meeting and I finally picked up the book, ripped it in half, and threw it in the trash. Everyone cheered.

  43. Dan from Georgia says:

    I am glad to hear that Xenia!

  44. WenatcheeTheHatchet says:

    Lots of people are sentenced to go through life without a partner if they never get married to begin with. 🙂

    What I find ghastly about the different forms of dominionism that have shown up in fundamentalist, evangelical and charismatic circles is that they clearly learned nothing by studying the trajectory of the old line/mainlines from the 19th century through to the Cold War. Most likely, American exceptionalism kicked in and they thought “Well, the mainlines did X and that led to Y but we’re better than that.” It’s a different kind of Manifest Destiny but just as ill-advised and ultimately just as antichrist.

    new socks are a good thing. New wool socks are particularly a good thing when winters are coming up!

  45. bob1 says:


    When you say mainline, are you referring to the mainline churches in the US?

  46. WenatcheeTheHatchet says:


    There weren’t any fundamentalist, evangelical or charismatic churches as we know them to even be around for the Native American boarding schools that sought to save the man by destroying the Indian, for instance. The F/E/C wings of American jingoistic Christianity couldn’t have invented their variation of manifest destiny out of whole cloth and my take, polemical though I admit it is, is they parasitically adapted dominionist tendencies from the earlier denominations they were splitting off from before they became fundamentalist, evangelical or charismatic respectively. This isn’t to say I think it’s bad the mainlines have dropped their variations of Manifest Destiny civic religion, more that the conservative groups that think they are charting a new path to take back the U.S. don’t seem to realize they’re just doing a right-wing lurch of an impulse that, as MLD put it, has always been around in the history of what is now the US.

  47. filbertz says:

    #1 is worth the price of admission–especially “Sound theology spoken from a cold heart becomes a lie.”

  48. Em says:

    Religious tolerance, though confined to Christian faith expressions was an improvement over Old World State religions, was it not?
    Also, taking the Faith into tribal areas was attempted with some success…. Like today, though, sadly the majority rejected then….. What to do? Some good intentions and, like today, some bad with bad results… Sad? Yep

  49. WenatcheeTheHatchet says:

    Em, I don’t actually take that as a given for either paragraph. Anti-Catholic prejudice is why I don’t take the proposal in paragraph 1 without severe qualifications, and the role that formal churches played in collaborating with the U.S. government to convert or expel tribes is partly why many a Native American refuses to adopt Christianity. I know of relatives who voluntarily converted who didn’t win points with their communities for converting.

    As for “what to do?” well, Ta-nehisi Coates has had an idea about “what to do?” that he’s been pretty passionate about. 🙂 I think McWhorter and Reed have made cogent arguments for why that idea won’t fly at all in electoral terms but I’m trying to avoid getting too deep into those kinds of discussions and debates.

  50. bob1 says:

    Unfortunately, our fallen hearts and minds create chaos, intolerance and unnecessary suffering whether it’s here in America or in the Old World.

    Ask the Latter-Day Saints and the Catholics, as mentioned, about “religious tolerance” here. And I’m sure there are more…

  51. Mike E. says:

    NBC News: Lawyers say they can’t find the parents of 545 migrant children separated by Trump administration. About two-thirds of the 1,000-plus parents separated from their kids under a 2017 pilot program were deported before a federal judge ordered that they be found.

  52. bob1 says:

    Good God.

    If true…unconscionable.

  53. Babylon’s Dread says:

    “If true” is the demise of America. No one believes anything.

  54. Michael says:

    “If true”…
    I wish people would just cut the bs and own what we’re doing and what we have done.
    This is not the first time we’ve lost parents or children.
    America the Great has demanded that toddlers appear in immigration court alone.
    I could literally write an article every day about the moral and ethical evils that this administration has perpetrated on vulnerable human beings.
    Are they the first admin to do so?
    Hell no…this is almost an American sport.
    However, no administration has conjured up the forms of cruelty that Trump and his spawn of Satan Stephen Miller have devised.
    This is what is going on now…we can’t fix the past.
    The truth is that most God loving and God fearing Americans approve of these crimes against humanity and the hatred and violence against the neighbor will continue.
    There will be judgment against this as surely as there will be against abortion…

  55. Jean says:


    The Trump campaign has hatched a new attack on truth by sowing doubt as to whether bin Laden is actually dead. Why? Apparently because his assassination took place under Obama. Is there any ethical limit at all in what someone is willing to say or do to obtain or retain power? Do American Christians even care?

  56. Mike E. says:

    Michael…”I could literally write an article every day about the moral and ethical evils that this administration has perpetrated on vulnerable human beings.” Just…so….grieved…and…angry…and sad. These vulnerable human beings are loved by God just as much as any unborn child. “There will be judgment.” Indeed. Let it start in the American church. God have mercy on us all. JEAN..”Do American Christians even care?” The answer is so many unfortunately don’t.

  57. Babylon’s Dread says:

    Of course people care — I’ll say it again — they don’t believe what they read reported. Why? Because media is so politicized and so geared to offend that the media doesn’t strive for truth. Virtually no one does. We truth-shape we don’t truth tell. So I read about the separated kids and frankly I don’t believe the facts will bear it out. I ask, “what are they NOT telling us and why?”

    Michael rants about the story — as he should — but I’m simply pointing out that credibility has DIED in America and it is our demise. Then Jean proves my point with the Bin Laden nonsense.

    People care — even those evil Christians that we so easily smear — they just don’t believe what’s being reported.

    Truth has died and lawlessness will abound because of it.

  58. WTH.
    I have recently begun re-examining a lot of my concepts on the evolution of American Christianity. It resulted in a lot of swirling ideas that I wish I could categorize better. Here is one area:

    I thought City of a Hill was just Puritan slogan. I never stopped to ponder how long-winded Puritans could tolerate a brief sermonet. But, apparently it’s like the National Anthem, we only sing one chorus.

    A Model of Christian Charity was actually long. It is apparent the John Withrop’s Puritan vision for the new colony was authoritarian, racist and was founded on structural inequality. The difference I see from envisioned New Israel, and later European Fascism, is the European model contained a messianic figure. Withrop’s model was based on theology the bound all members in society in uniformity.

    I make these conclusions because the Westminster Confession already codified a godly seed concept. Puritans saw themselves as New Israel. And, Puritan society not only was intolerant, but racist and exploitive. New England became a dumping ground for English subjects deemed undesirable, and only 11 years after Winthrop sermon, the Massachusetts slave Act was passed to define terms of indenture versus chattel slavery.
    Here is the longer Model of Christian Charity.

  59. Duane Arnold says:


    There is also a willful blindness that allows us not to see what we don’t want to see…

  60. Babylon’s Dread says:


    If you mean it when you say “us” I’ll agree. Otherwise that’s just a useful shaped narrative.

  61. Duane Arnold says:


    It appears to be a common human malady…

  62. Babylon’s Dread says:

    And Priddis

    I think you have imported a lot of culturally bound value systems into that assessment. The points of view you impose on the Puritans were not exactly available to them.

    After all we’re judging the inheritance they’ve left us not bearing the weight of crossing oceans and burying most of our companions while trying to build said new Israel.

    How easily we despise outcomes others could not have foreseen.

  63. Jean says:


    You display a typical willful blindness and deafness associated with Trump’s base. You blame the media for biased news, while failing to acknowledge that no media source in America produces more fake news than Trump’s Twitter feed and press conferences.

    You wrote: “Then Jean proves my point with the Bin Laden nonsense.” Notice the deflection and denial. Do you deny that Trump re-Tweeted that assertion? Because I heard him directly defend it.

  64. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    Jean – you missed Bab’s point entirely. He is not defending some and blaming others – he is saying that no one believes any of the information coming from any source these days.

    And I would guess especially 2 weeks before an election.

  65. Babylon’s Dread says:


    I don’t read Trump’s Twitter feed — ever. So that may contribute to my willful blindness. I’m consistently inclusive of left and right when it comes to truth shaping and lying.

    Trump and Kamala/Biden lie in equal and opposite ways.

    My post was not at all partisan.

    My support of Trump is policy based not Trump based. He makes it near impossible.

    I’ve said such for years. Either way your repeat of the misinformation makes my point.

  66. Jean says:

    Aside from perhaps Bolsonaro, I’m aware of no other leader of a country in the entire world who has BS’d his citizens more, pretty much from Day 1, regarding the Coronavirus pandemic. Now our citizenry is so divided and confused about what’s going on and what to do that we’re entering the fall in a very poor situation.

    Thousands of additional lives are being lost and will be lost in our country directly attributable to Trump’s lies and lack of leadership. He doesn’t have the interest, empathy, attention span or management skills to lead the nation through a national crises. Even if we get a safe and effective vaccine, millions won’t take it because of Trump’s interference with the development process.

  67. Michael says:

    “Of course people care — I’ll say it again — they don’t believe what they read reported.”
    It’s my blog, but Bowden will come back and bludgeon me if I use any other word.
    They believe it…or else they wouldn’t scream “Obama did it first”!
    They believe it…the same way they believe me when I write about corrupt pastors…you have to break some eggs to make an omelet, you know.
    They believe it…but these are people from “shithole” countries and they are less than human.
    Now, let me hasten to say that there are a few exhausted historic Christians living on the border amidst the terror trying to mitigate the blows from the christian nationalists…they believe too.

  68. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    Europe is exploding right now – is that Trump’s doing LOL

    “millions won’t take it because of Trump’s interference with the development process.” You must follow Kamala too closely – like you, she seems to think that Trump himself is mixing the vaccine brew in the WH basement.

  69. Jean says:

    “You must follow Kamala too closely”

    I asked you respectfully and repeatedly last week to leave me out of your commentary. I’m done being polite. Entertain yourself at someone else’s expense.

  70. Michael says:

    This is an obscenity.
    Trump used unending lies about migrants and immigrants and the border to win the last election with the help of the right wing media.

    I’ve never said this publicly, but I’ll say it now.
    The first time I wrote a story about the abuse of children from the border being attacked by evangelicals screaming at them to go home we lost 50% of our readers and 75% of our financial support.
    The reader numbers recovered, the financials never did.
    That was long before the 2016 election and how I knew Trump would win.
    They believe and they applaud…little bastards will learn to stay home.

  71. Michael says:


    I’m the only one who can swear here and I don’t direct it at another person.

  72. Babylon’s Dread says:


    Some of us actually don’t believe it.

    As for the Obama issue. What we recall is the zero outcry against Obama doing it.

    I still wonder if most of these kids were not being trafficked. There that issue too.

    Where are the good sources of info now that St Bowden has died?

    Awaiting MAD Dread

  73. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    Jean – I don’t think that is the way blogs work.

  74. Michael says:

    Covid19 is spreading through my county like the wildfire.
    Because a great many of the people who got burned out where farm laborers and their families.
    They have crowded into whatever relatives house available to keep working the coming harvests.
    They are afraid to get tested because they might get deported.

  75. Michael says:

    “Some of us actually don’t believe it.”

    That must be how you folks live with yourselves.
    If you seriously doubt whats happening down there it is from willful ignorance, not lack of credible information.
    I wrote on these pages and on Facebook that Obama was an immigration disaster…and was told it wasn’t true…because the right wing media claimed he was weak.
    “I still wonder if most of these kids were not being trafficked.”
    You have got to be kidding.
    My city school system is (was) 40% Hispanic before the fire.
    My godson went to school with the ones lucky enough to get here.
    The most disgusting part of this war on migrants is taking a real evil (child trafficking) and applying it to their account.
    Most traffickers are middle aged white Americans…look it up.
    Sources…what the hell good would that do at this point?
    You will dismiss them as leftists or deranged or liars…even though their work has been consistent for decades.

  76. Michael says:

    Let me be really freaking clear about this.
    This, to me, isn’t a political issue at it’s core.
    It’s a normal, ethical, and biblical issue.
    It’s the very heart of the Gospel.

  77. Michael says:

    The court filing in the case by ACLU and others is available here:

    WASHINGTON — Lawyers appointed by a federal judge to identify migrant families who were separated by the Trump administration say that they have yet to track down the parents of 545 children and that about two-thirds of those parents were deported to Central America without their children, according to a filing Tuesday from the American Civil Liberties Union.

    The Trump administration instituted a “zero tolerance” policy in 2018 that separated migrant children and parents at the southern U.S. border. The administration later confirmed that it had actually begun separating families in 2017 along some parts of the border under a pilot program. The ACLU and other pro-bono law firms were tasked with finding the members of families separated during the pilot program.

    Unlike the 2,800 families separated under zero tolerance in 2018, most of whom remained in custody when the policy was ended by executive order, many of the more than 1,000 parents separated from their children under the pilot program had already been deported before a federal judge in California ordered that they be found.

    “It is critical to find out as much as possible about who was responsible for this horrific practice while not losing sight of the fact that hundreds of families have still not been found and remain separated,” said Lee Gelernt, deputy director of the ACLU Immigrants’ Rights Project. “There is so much more work to be done to find these families.

    “People ask when we will find all of these families, and sadly, I can’t give an answer. I just don’t know,” Gelernt said. “But we will not stop looking until we have found every one of the families, no matter how long it takes. The tragic reality is that hundreds of parents were deported to Central America without their children, who remain here with foster families or distant relatives.”

    The ACLU and other organizations that are part of a court-appointed “steering committee” learned that more than 1,000 families were separated in 2017 based on data provided by the Department of Homeland Security. Of those, the committee has been able to contact the parents of more than 550 children and believes about 25 of them may have a chance to come back to the U.S. for reunification.

    Gelernt said some of the families that have been contacted have elected to keep their children in the U.S. with family members or sponsors “due to fear of what will happen to their child if they return” to their home countries.

  78. Michael says:

    Trump admitting he spread the insanity that Jean mentioned.
    I did not edit this.

  79. Em says:

    We broad brush and label…. Not good !
    For instance… 😁
    My maternal great grandmother was a Puritan and she was part of the movement to educate the freed slaves at the end of the Civil War…
    My grandmother, part of the turn of the century Holiness movement? You would denigrate a black at your peril in her presence. She was outraged at the swooping up of every Japanese citizen to place them in internment camps during WW2.
    I suspect both of these, now departed ladies, would tell you that there are good and bad actors of every skin shade…
    Including those coming across our southern (and northern) border
    Just sayin….. to quote a sister here

  80. Babylon’s Dread says:

    “How you folks live with yourselves.”

    I know you decried Obama on immigration. I don’t consider you part of the media per se but perhaps I should. I don’t recall any outcry over separation policies before Trump — even from you but I might be wrong.

    The information you just posted is helpful.

    You’re wrath is helpful also.

    I think I can live with myself despite your disapproval. We shall see.

  81. bob1 says:

    I saw the youtube. What a big baby. He’s not responsible for anything! He only retweeted!

    “As the Donald Trump parenthesis in the republic’s history closes, he is opening the sluices on his reservoir of invectives and self-pity. A practitioner of crybaby conservatism — no one, he thinks, has suffered so much since Job lost his camels and acquired boils — and ever a weakling, Trump will end his presidency as he began it: whining.” — George Will

  82. Michael says:

    “St. Bowden”
    When he died it was like a sign from above to me that we had been given over to the lies we love.
    I fell into a pit I’m just now climbing out of.
    It turned out even worse than I could have known.
    He wrote more than once that a Trump would come and the people would embrace him…and he wrote that clear back in the nineties.
    The pit has advantages that I’m still debating leaving.

  83. josh hamrick says:

    Fellas, we’re brothers. There is none righteous on either side of the political divide. Let’s stick together.

  84. Michael says:


    The single most heartbreaking part of all of this to me is that good people can live with this.

  85. Michael says:


    This isn’t political to me.
    It’s Gospel.
    It’s love of the neighbor as ourselves that really is a reflection of how we love God.
    I would expect heathens not to love little migrant children and parents hoping for a better future for them.
    When the church doesn’t care I wonder which one of us has worshipped a different Jesus.
    I’m reminded that the Good Samaritan would have been considered a heretic.

  86. Babylon’s Dread. says:

    I question information and you turn in into me approving of bad outcomes. Michael sometimes your rage is not your friend.

    I’m pretty careful about what I say. I’m not always perfectly informed but I’m careful.

    You’ve chastened me and made it personal so now going to drop this.

  87. josh hamrick says:

    Michael, I agree…and I think we’d all agree.

    It’s the political climate that is causing the division, and I hope we won’t fall for it.

    Let’s urge one another towards good works in love.

  88. Michael says:

    I don’t unlimber here (or anywhere else) much on this topic anymore.
    Wisdom is a process of urinating into the wind less frequently.
    The last four years have changed us…changed me.
    We have lost what only future generations can try to recover.
    We have lost…and others will count the cost.

  89. Michael says:


    “Michael, I agree…and I think we’d all agree.”
    We don’t agree…and I pray that you and others your age can repair what we’ve done to our witness.
    As I told a friend last week…you matter.

  90. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    Yet look at what the left media puts out without any evidence that gets swallowed hook, line and sinker by the anti Trumpers — and tweeted and retweeted.
    1.) The Atlantic story about what Trump said in France – 4 off the record people vs 26 on the record folks who were there on the scene in France. Campaign fodder!

    2.) The NYT story about Trump’s taxes – and they will not show the taxes they say are in their possession – to back up their claims.
    This by the paper which in 1970/71 received the Pentagon Papers and published them right away – front page. Not only that, published them in book form.

    It’s election time and false stories are allowed – on both sides – no one cares and no one believes. Campaign fodder!

    It’s been a month – where are the follow up stories on the forced sterilizations on the border? There were supposed to be hundreds in Georgia and the best any one can find is that only 2 patients were referenced out to the doctor for unknown procedures. No one fired – no one arrested. Campaign fodder.

    Babs was 100% correct in last nights 10:17pm.

  91. Michael says:


    I have fed information for 15 years.
    I’ve offered books, white papers, and testimonies of Christian workers on the border.
    I introduced everyone to Bowden and others.
    I have not been inconsistent in my witness…until it was shown to be folly.

  92. Michael says:

    “It’s been a month – where are the follow up stories on the forced sterilizations on the border? ”
    It’s still being investigated…in Georgia…by the administration.
    I just posted a link to the story of the lost parents with the court record.

    Do both sides use the media to lie outrageously.
    We wouldn’t have it any other way.

  93. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    I don’t think the media gets used by “the sides” to do their lying.
    I think the media has BECOME “the sides” and they use politicians to carry their water.

  94. Bride of Christ says:

    I attended Calvary Chapels in southern California for over 35 years, and I remember Brian Broderson teaching that divorced people should return to their original spouses or they wouldn’t get Iinto heaven. He taught this at a Sunday service and It surprised me – he must have read the same book Xenia did! I was never divorced, so It didn’t make any difference to me personally. About 6 months later, Pastor Broderson announced that he was mistaken about his previous teaching about divorce. I wondered if anyone went back to their original spouse during those 6 months or left their second spouse. I want to say that Babylon’s Dread post claiming Christians really would “care” about the suffering at the border, but they doubt its happening is simply false. Christians, at least Calvary Chapel Christians, have allowed their hearts to grow cold. I’d like to relate to you why I left Calvary after 35 years. The last year that I attended Calvary I met with a group of women from my Calgary Chapel for a friend’s birthday. While there several women were all sadly discussing the death of a young mother of three who had died that week of heart disease. This woman attended our Calvary Chapel Vista church and she left behind three very young children and a husband. The woman had no health insurance and she could not afford her heart medication so she simply did not take any. This gathering took place just one week after The Affordable Card Act was signed I to law by the Democrats. Just 15 minutes after this talk of our sister in Christ and young mother dying because she had no health coverage the talk in the room turned to the Affordable Care Act. Without exception every person in the room started talking about how awful and terrible the ACA was. I was shocked and speechless. How could they not SEE that surely this young mother would be alive today if she had had health coverage? I knew these women and they were intelligent women. The only conclusion was that, for them, political affiliation was far stronger than their love for even one of their own sisters in Christ. This was so chilling for me that I left the gathering, shaken and despairing. I stopped attending Calvary Chapel altogether just six months later. The church had changed, and I hadn’t. I still had compassion and love for my fellow Christians, but I was witnessing a church whose first Love for Christ and others,had grown cold.

  95. Michael says:
    What New Official Data Tells Us About the Ongoing Tragedy at the U.S.-Mexico Border
    by Adam Isacson
    The U.S. government’s 2020 fiscal year ended on September 30, and on October 14 U.S. Customs and Border Protection (CBP) and its Border Patrol component produced data about what happened at the U.S.-Mexico border in this pandemic-marred year. The numbers paint a stark picture of a man-made humanitarian disaster that, in the Trump administration’s fourth year, has entered a new phase.

    We now have a picture of undocumented migrants who were apprehended at the border or who presented themselves at border crossings (ports of entry). We have at least some sense of where they were apprehended, where many came from, and whether they were adults, children, or families. We can see how many among those categories was permitted to approach a port of entry. And we know how many were summarily expelled under the Trump administration’s pandemic border measures.

    Border Patrol apprehended 400,651 undocumented migrants during fiscal 2020. That may sound like a lot, but it was actually the 6th smallest annual number of migrant apprehensions during the past 48 years. If Border Patrol maintained its 2019 staffing strength of 16,700 agents at the border, then each agent apprehended an average of 24 migrants all year—2 per month.

    400,651 apprehended migrants is 53 percent fewer than in 2019. And those who were children or family members dropped by 85 percent from last year. In the past several years, a large portion of apprehended kids and families were Central Americans seeking protection in the United States, fleeing some of the world’s worst gang and organized crime-tied violence, among other extreme political, economic, and environmental conditions. The Trump administration dealt severe blows to this vulnerable population. First, the “Remain in Mexico” program and other initiatives made it virtually impossible to access asylum at the border. Then, the Department of Homeland Security (DHS) interpreted Centers for Disease Control (CDC) pandemic border measures to mean that it could rapidly expel all undocumented people apprehended at the border, even those seeking refuge.

    Migration plummeted, especially between March and June. The number of apprehended migrants from El Salvador, Guatemala, and Honduras dropped by 83 percent. Mexico is again the number one country of citizenship for apprehended migrants.

    More than 205,000 people have been expelled since March, often in as little as 90 minutes. As of August, 8,800 of them were unaccompanied children, who were returned unaccompanied, to an unknown fate. Every month, the number of expulsions is greater than the last: in September, 50,067 people were expelled under the CDC order, including 1,740 who had presented at official border crossings (ports of entry).


  96. Michael says:

    Bride of Christ,

    Thank you.

  97. Michael says:


    My wrath has dissipated with age and infirmity.
    What you see now may look wrathful,but it’s really confusion and despair.

  98. Em says:

    MLD @ 11:12….
    Sure looks like SOMEBODY’S pulling the strings…. ?
    Harris and Pelosi scare this old lady… scare me a lot…
    I remember as a child listening to a discussion in my grandparent’s kitchen, “Democrats are the friend of the working man! ”
    Even then i remember thinking, “Okay, but don’t we want people in charge who know how to organize and run things?”
    Dunno, though, do i ? 🙆

  99. bob1 says:


    Your report of being shocked at the animosity of these folks toward the ACA parallels something that happened to me.

    It must’ve been during Obama’s second term. We had some friends over and were just talking about stuff. Then all of a sudden they started trashing President Obama something fierce and extremely irrational! My wife and I were shocked and after these folks left, we tried to figure out what the hell had just happened. It was almost like being thrust into an alternative universe, thankfully temporarily.

  100. Em says:

    Michael, none of us are in charge AND, as hard to grasp as it is, history is playing out exact as God designed. Don’t despair !

    In July the hospital wouldn’t admit me as my covid test came back “inconclusive.” I had to go for 2 whole weeks breathing through my mouth and i am not a mouth breather. LOL
    2 weeks of never more than one hour of uninterrupted sleep. So ?
    My point is that, for SOME unknown reason i recalled our Lord’s words when facing crucifixion, “nevertheless, not my will, but Thine be done!”. Incredible submission and i realized just how amazing the cost of our redemption …. guess it did me good to be amazed 😮 and to realise how puny i am in the face of testing…
    May God give you strength and hope as you go through this in a fatigued and human testing
    All the sermons I’ve heard over the years regarding Satan’s hatred of us….. had to wonder if I’d have accepted redemption if beforehand i realized what i was signing up for… A war? I hate war…. but….
    I ramble….

  101. Michael says:

    ” had to wonder if I’d have accepted redemption if beforehand i realized what i was signing up for…”

    I’ve always claimed I was drafted… 🙂

  102. pstrmike says:

    dread said,

    “I’m pretty careful about what I say. ” I’d hate to read what you edit out! LOL!!!!!
    have a good day!!!

  103. Xenia says:

    Michael, you think your issue is the one that matters most. That’s ok, we all have things that our consciences tell us to work on because we cannot work on everything.

    You are now accusing those who are working on other godly issues (instead of the one you care about the most) of not following the real Gospel message.

    Can’t you at least agree that there are many issues at play and that good and godly people may choose to concentrate issues different from yours?

    There is a lot of evil in this country. We should rejoice that people are attempting to combat some of these evils and not dismiss those who have chosen different evils from yours to combat. I worry about the evil the Dems have in store for us but this does not mean I don’t care about the evils the Repubs have done.

    The devil is the author of confusion and he’s having fun on the PhxP. He is dividing brothers and sisters for having chosen which evil they want to fight.

    I affirm those who want to fix the situation on the border.
    I affirm those who want to see the end (or lessening) of abortion, radical feminism, radical homosexuality, perversion being taught in schools and a host of other things.

    Choose well, but have some charity for those who have chosen differently.

  104. BOC. I have had similar conversations with devoted Evangelicals that care deeply about others. They where horrified and opposed to Obama Care, but could not identify what ACA meant. Obama is a trigger word.

    If I went back to them today, I doudt the could identify ACA. The individuals I am referring to likely have a higher IQ then I. We are just funny creatures.

  105. bob1 says:


    Harris and Pelosi scare this old lady… scare me a lot…

    There’s medication for that. 🙂

    You do realize that the Democrats are the ones who created and sustained Social Security and Medicare, right? There were Reublican conservatives who’ve been fighting this one tooth and nail since they
    were created. And that’s just 2 successes. There are more.

  106. bob1 says:

    The devil is the author of confusion

    If that’s the case, then our current President is being controlled by you know who.

  107. Michael says:

    “Michael, you think your issue is the one that matters most.”
    I have never said that.
    Not even once.
    It is the one area I know something about and when I hear people talk about evil, I wonder why they only speak of ideological evil and actual evils only when it is abortion.

    “I affirm those who want to see the end (or lessening) of abortion, radical feminism, radical homosexuality, perversion being taught in schools and a host of other things.”

    Those things can’t be changed politically as a majority of Americans support them.
    A church that still had moral authority might have been able to.

    I really don’t care who people vote for…I care that evil is ignored for pragmatic purposes and therefore flourishes while children suffer.

  108. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    bob 1,
    obviously you live in an alternative universe. The only reason the Dems care about SS and Medicare is so they have one more fund to raid – they use it like their own private piggy bank. Back in 2012 when the GOP lobbied to make it a “lock box” fund that no one could touch, the Dems messed their pants over it.
    Come now, don’t be deceived.

  109. Duane Arnold says:


    “I really don’t care who people vote for…I care that evil is ignored for pragmatic purposes and therefore flourishes while children suffer.”

    Partially ignored and partially denied. I’m not sure which is worse. Ignoring the issue means that you are at least partially aware of the truth of the situation. It betrays a lack of empathy or concern. Denial, in the terms of “its not so bad”, “the media is inventing the story”, “you can’t believe the pictures”, etc., may be far more dangerous. After all, in spite of the overwhelming evidence of history, film, documents, eyewitnesses and so much more, there are those who deny the Holocaust. Simple denial is much more comforting because we don’t even have to acknowledge that what is taking place at the border is real. If it’s not real, we don’t have to care…

  110. Michael says:


    Well said.
    I still choose to believe that if I loaded everyone up and we went on a field trip to Juarez, they would want to help.
    I hope I’m right.

  111. Bride of Christ says:

    I mentioned Calvary Chapel Vista, so I would like to relate another story, to be fair to pastors there. When the ACA first passed, around the same time of the gathering I spoke of earlier, we walked into the church Lobby to find tables spread around asking people to sign petitions calling for the recall of the ACA. My husband and I had both lost our jobs in the midst of ” the great recession ( I as a teacher and my husband as a new car dealership manager) and both of us were on unemployment and we were relieved that The ACA had passed because I was actually cashing in some of my retirement funds to pay for both my husband’s and my health insurance which was close to $ 2,000 each month ( we were both in our fifties). We downsized three times, selling two houses, and moving three times to smaller and smaller houses in order to stay afloat and near our daughters, one who was in her last year at UCLA university during this period. It was a traumatic time in our lives to say the least! Seeing those tables set up calling for recalling the ACA was very depressing and discouraging for us I remember when we sat down in the sanctuary for the service Pastor Rob Salvador came out and announced that he had cleared away the tables from the lobby. “That has no place here”, he said, and he seemed a little angry. When we left the service, all the tables had been taken down. We always liked Pastor Rob, and when he made that announcement my husband and I signed with relief. I don’t know what forces are shaping the Calvary Chapels today to make them so political, but not all of the pastors there should be blamed. We now attend North Coast Church in Vista, which is not affiliated with Calvary. If is evangelical, but there seems to much more love and much less hate there, and there is absolutely zero political endorsements or activity from any of the leadership at North Coast Church.

  112. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    “I still choose to believe that if I loaded everyone up and we went on a field trip to Juarez, they would want to help.”

    I help everyone I run across who needs help. If I can’t do it myself I enlist help of my church. But the “border” is a public policy issue and there is nothing I can do outside of working in the system.

    When you say we go to Juarez to help, I hope you mean to feed, clothe, house and offer medical attention and that you are not suggesting we work around the border issue by loading them up in the trunks of our car and running them across the border.

  113. Bride of Christ says:

    MLD, The issue of abortion is also a “public policy” issue, indeed it has been settled constitutional law for nearly fifty years now, and yet that has not stopped Christians from rising up in arms against the practice of abortion. Can you explain the difference between the two issues for us, as they both pertain to life?

  114. Mike E. says:

    What if we are all putting God in a box we have made? Each of us has our issues we feel strongly about, as Xenia pointed out. What if God is actually working His will through both the democrat and republican parties? Is He unable to do that? Because I assure you He is…doctrine of providence, anyone? At the same time, when we look at the overview of Scripture, God is constantly (and I mean constantly) taking up for the weak and vulnerable. And He punished His people severely for their oppression and injustice to the poor. What He sees at the border disgust Him and will incur His wrath, just as the aborted babies will (and obviously has already). All I know is this…I have suffered my whole adult life from the emotional trauma that occurred to me as a child. If people cannot see that these children are ALREADY PERMANENTLY scarred, there is willful ignorance involved. BD says there’s no truth. Bullcrap. This crap is happening and to deny it, therefore accepting it (because it allegedly doesn’t exist, in some people’s minds), is immoral. BD, do you think the ICE facilities do not exist, because NBC told you they do? Hasn’t even Fox News reported on these facilities and filmed them? Do you believe no children have been separated from their families? For goodness sake, it started as the official policy under former attorney general Sessions and was purposefully designed as a deterrent to keep people from coming here. Do you think they’re all “crisis actors,” hired and paid by the evil Jew George Soros? Do you deny the hundreds of conspiracy theories that have no basis in reality (QANON anyone?), spread constantly by Mr. Trump AND his millions of followers? This is insane. There IS objective truth in this world, and if you can’t see it, I suggest some deeper self-examination.

  115. Duane Arnold says:


    “I still choose to believe that if I loaded everyone up and we went on a field trip to Juarez, they would want to help.”

    Maybe that’s the point. If you deny that the problem is there or that you can’t believe the media, then there’s no reason to go to Juarez. Denial enables us not merely to ignore the problem (which is bad enough), it allows us to say that there is no problem to ignore. “Fake news” and “left wing media” are great slogans, especially when one wants to deny the reality of what is being reported…

  116. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    Not a problem. I support people in the political system who view Roe as flawed and will work to overturn it.
    I am also aware enough to understand that ending Roe does not end abortion.

    Now on the border issue it ends when enough people are persuaded to support politicians in the system who will legislate against whatever people think should be ended. This is not rocket science.

    Look, those of us in the anti abortion crowd had not had any more success than those in the change immigration crowd.

  117. Xenia says:

    I agree that the situation on the border is terrible. I think this is an extremely worthy cause to care about and to work for. I am not calling anyone names or imputing evil motives to anyone who cares about the border and intend to vote or write about it. I am for you and not against you. I will not call you names, say you believe in a lesser Gospel message, or say that you only care about the border because you have self-serving motives. You care, and may God bless you for caring about this.

    Why can’t you reciprocate?

  118. Bride of Christ says:

    Xenia, ” I will not say that you believe in a lesser Gospel message, or that you care about border issues because you have self-serving motives” This is precisely what Calvary Chapel says to Christian Democrats. They go so far as to say you can’t possible be a “real” Christian if you are a Democrat. Many Evangelicals have claimed that Christians can only be Republicans and they must vote Republican. By taking this stand they are telling folks that the only issues that matter are the issues that Republicans say matter. They don’t share your view that there are other, serious humanitarian issues plaguing our country today that need to be rectified. We left Calvary Chapel because this message was very clearly communicated to us there. The year I left the leader of the women’s ministry preached to the women of the church during the election and urged us all to pick up the Republican voting guides on our way out of the sanctuary. That’s fine; every year Calvary Chapel did this. But then she said, ” You may think you have the right to vote however you want, but you DON’T. You DON’T get to vote however you feel like – you DON’T have that right”. I was pretty shocked. This woman was one of the few women in Calvary Chapel known throughout the entire country, married to a leading Calvary Chapel pastor known around the world. I never was quite sure if she meant that we had to vote how our husbands told us to, or how our church told us to, but she was very clear that we had no right to follow our own conscious or be guided by the Holy Spirit when we cast our ballots.

  119. Xenia says:

    This is precisely what Calvary Chapel says to Christian Democrats. <<<

    This blog is not a Calvary Chapel. I am concerned about we here on the blog are saying to each other.

  120. Xenia says:

    I will say that my Christian conscience will not allow me to vote for the Dems but I am not playing Holy Spirit for anyone else.

  121. Michael says:


    I have scanned the thread to find where I called anyone names.
    You will have to show me as I can’t find it.
    I can’t find where I did any of the things you say I did.
    I can fully understand a Christian conscience unable to vote blue.
    I cannot understand how that same conscience can vote red, either.
    Seems incongruous.
    But, as you say, I’m not the Spirit for anyone else.

  122. Nancy Holmes says:

    Mike E

    Thanks so much for what you wrote at 1:17. I agree with so much that you said. Thank you for challenging BD. He doesn’t seem to have replied to your questions yet. He may try to distract by turning the focus in another direction. I am indeed curious as to his answers–if any…

  123. Bride of Christ says:

    This blog is for all Christians and I read extensively about these issues. It is not just Calvary Chapel saying this. It is Franklin Graham, among others. Many, many evangelicals are preaching this to their congregations. We are discussing issues facing the church in general. Calvary Chapel is still the largest evangelical church in southern California and has an outsider influence here in southern California. I believe Michael was addressing the church as a whole in America! I just want to add that it was George Bryson’s wife who told us women that we had no right to vote how the Lord led us. I don’t want anyone to think it was someone else that still teaches at Calvary Chapel Vista.

  124. Xenia says:

    Michael, I see derision in many of your posts.

    I don’t see any point in continuing in this vein.

    I’m outta here til after the election. I’ve got a big project to work on and I should get to it.

    I believe that everyone here is voting their consciences. May everything turn out well in all the issues that concern us.

    If our guy doesn’t win, may we accept defeat gracefully.

    Bye for a few weeks.



  125. Jean says:

    When I recall the Parable of the Good Samaritan, I don’t recall him checking with the half-dead dude in ditch whether he was pro-LGBT or a feminist, or whether he he was a BLM supporter or supported the right to choose, he was just a guy who needed help.

    I can understand the leisure some folk enjoy to deplore the ideologies of one stripe or another. We should build an Areopagus for such matters.

    But, then, there are millions of Americans who are in fear that the next shoe will drop:

    Will they get kicked off there health insurance because this Administration and the GOP are committed to the repeal of the ACA?

    Will they lose food stamps during a pandemic because the Administration wants to re-write the rules?

    Will they lose, or not return to their job, because we are a nation without a national plan to address the coronavirus pandemic. China grew in Q3, while we are sinking.

    Will a corporation build a chemical plant in their neighborhood, because the Administration has repealed environmental regulations?

    Will they privatize and destroy the retirement safety net provided by Medicare and Social Security, because the GOP has been trying to do just that for decades?

    Will working men and women lose any remedy whatsoever for unsafe working conditions because Corporate Mitch and the GOP want to pass the most extreme corporate liability shields for corporation during a pandemic?

    Will it become open season for assault on LGBT people because of the repeal of protections?

    Will black boys and men continue to be at risk of their life just for being black by a law enforcement system which is systemically is biased against them?

    So, I see tens of millions of kitchen table reasons to vote for Biden.

  126. Em says:

    The problem at the border is NOT a charity nor a compassion problem… IMV …. It is human nature dealing with human nature – good and bad. It is a situation that will be solved by heartless extremes or it will continue until the United States is no longer a Mecca for both the oppressed and the evil doers…

  127. Em says:

    The Affordable Care Act is, in the state of Washington, a myth
    Unless you are dirt poor on welfare

  128. Jean says:

    According to the Washington Health Benefit Exchange, 212,000 Washington citizens enrolled in the myth during the open enrollment period in 2019. That is not counting folks who qualified for the expanded Medicaid coverage that the ACA provides for State that opt in.

  129. Nancy Holmes says:

    Okay Xenia–I guess it is “goodbye for now” time then. I find it interesting that what you interpret as “derision” expressed by Michael, I instead hear as expressions of a broken heart. Broken hearts frequently don’t sound all sweet, melodic and/or even reasonable. I take the long view–and I do believe that his broken heart is in the right place at the foot of the cross. I do not find him offensive in his honest wrestling before the Lord and the rest of us lesser creatures. Guess I will stick around…

  130. Jean says:

    “Total Medicaid enrollment in Washington was 1,728,400 — including 549,700 people covered by Medicaid expansion — as of June 2019. tracking as of June 2020 show Washington Medicaid and CHIP enrollment as 1,780,968.”

  131. Em says:

    Jean, sorry but statistics don’t tell the whole story. We have too many hard working poor who cannot find enough do re mi to buy any kind of health insurance

  132. Jean says:

    Em, that’s where the expansion of Medicaid comes in. Is the system perfect? No. The remedy is to improve it if flaws are discovered. Not kick tens of millions off insurance and say, “trust me”. The GOP has had almost a decade to come up with a replacement and to date their plan is zilch and screw the poor. I say, “Screw the GOP.”

  133. Bride of Christ says:

    Em, the ACA is not a myth. I am 64 and my HMO with Health Net costs $996.00 each month. I only have to pay $675.00 a month and about $225.00 a month is chipped in by the ACA. I never did find another teaching job in the schools and my husband is retired and on Medicare. I am on my own as far as insurance, and I have been for the last 10 years since I was laid off after 30 plus years of teaching. I teach ceramics at the local recreation center, but just part-time and no health insurance us included with the job. I have been receiving my health coverage through the ACA for 10 years. I have CSTR, but I withdrew much of my contributions when I lost my job in order to weather the storm of a double job loss and keep my family afloat. I receive only $650.00 a month with my teacher’s pension, which covers my entire share of my health insurance premium. My niece ( a college graduate) has three jobs, each with no health insurance, and she has a health plan through the ACA. Millions of Americans have healthcare only because of the Affordable Care Act. By the way, I love your posts about horses – I grew up with two in my backyard and those were the happiest years of my life. Such sweet animals and so much fun to ride, especially if you lived in the back country of New England, which I did.

  134. Michael says:

    Obamacare has kept me alive.

    I do know too many working families who’ve been devastated by it, however.
    We need to fix it, not discard it.

  135. I purchase a plan on the Exchanges. I have had employer provided health care for one (1) year in my entire life. Individual insurance prior to the ACA was a three hour tour. At no time in 20 years did the Republicans ever attempt to improve the situation. Nor after.

  136. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    Trying to fix healthcare costs by getting the other guy to pay for it is a scam.
    Let’s mandate that healthcare providers chip in and cut their charges 30%.
    Big Pharma is the real culprit. Anyone who works for Big Pharma does so without a soul.

  137. Dan from Georgia says:

    Late here to what I wanted to comment on, but I am glad some here have mentioned voting your conscience. I did that in 2016 and will do so again in a few weeks. I’ve read enough online articles on a few Christian news websites basically telling me who to vote for, what will happen if I don’t vote their way, and that God will hold me accountable for not voting the way these authors think I should vote. Scare tactics and fear-mongering not only don’t motivate me in voting, it actually wants me to do the opposite just to stick it to them.

    I heard back in 2000 from a Bible study leader that he though Al Gore would win. He was asked why, and his response was “because he will start persecuting Christians”. Um….what? And then the same old trope about “this is the most important election in the history of our country” every election cycle. Maybe so this year, maybe not.

    So I am certain I will exercise my CIVIL rights and vote my conscience in a few weeks, not driven by fear, but by what I believe.

    Lastly, no matter how many times I say to myself I am not coming to this site anymore (I have no traction with Calvary Chapel or abusive churches or pastors for one), I am still drawn back here, and Bride of Christ alluded to why…there are some here with hearts that are big and open and I can relate to them.

  138. Dan from Georgia says:

    Correction: Nancy Holmes alluded to the hearts comment.

    Done for now. I would like to say “Go Braves” or “Go Vikes” or “Go Twins”, but I just ate a while ago….


  139. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    In other news related to #1, I see that the pope has put on his anti christ hat today with more false teaching.

  140. Mike E. says:

    Nancy Holmes–You thanked me for my 1:17 post. I am happy you could hear me. Sometimes it seems no one is listening. But I will also thank you for your 3:55 pm post. I’ve been on this blog for years and I have gotten to know Michael a bit. Michael’s heart is for the oppressed, the abused, and the marginalized. Quite simply, Michael loves the Lord. As does Xenia. Like us all, imperfect servants. Separately, do you think more than one person in all history was called a “person after God’s own heart?” Point to ponder.

  141. Muff Potter says:

    RE Nr. one up-top:
    I couldn’t care less what you (generic you) believe or disbelieve, I wanna’ know what kinda’ human being you are…

  142. Dan from Georgia says:

    Good words MIke E! I appreciate the hearts of the people here too.

  143. MLD, I don’t think that the pope is talking about blessing civil unions as a sacrament of the church, is he?

  144. Jim says:

    7. Few things make me happier than new socks…

    I disagree, you dirty leftist scum. How can someone call themself a Christian while supporting such a thing? Flip-flops, you pagan! CROCS FLIP-FLOPS!!!!

    I’ll feel better now knowing that I’ve convinced the masses.

  145. Michael says:


    This is Oregon…where people wear socks with flip flops.
    The end is near. 🙂

  146. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    This pope is pretty nutty. In the past we always knew how to respond to the question “is the pope Catholic?” – no longer.

    It is not hard to understand that in the least he is clear that children have no right to a mom and a dad.

  147. Em says:

    Bride of Christ, good to hear of your ACA experience. I don’t know how it is set up, but i believe it varies fro m state to state….
    I think of all the animals, God designed horses FOR man… Living here and filling in with their care when my daughter’s work keeps here away, ive learned that you can talk to them and sometimes it is clear that they understand…. 🙆

  148. Em says:

    I heard today that the Pope in office now approves of same sex marriage ? ? ? Has he ever read the Bible? Not his decision to make ! ! !
    Earlier i heard he wants Jesus’ earthly mother Mary honored as co-redeemer…. Guess he hasn’t or he thinks hiimself above God?

  149. Anon says:

    This is why the middle class is barely making it…

    “In the past four decades—under Democrats and Republicans alike—$50 trillion has moved from the bottom 90 percent to the top 1 percent of Americans.”

  150. Mike E. says:

    Aw come on, Anon…it’s the lefty Washington Post. We can’t believe anything they say. Like the Johnny Cash song. Oh and Pilate’s words also…”What is truth?” Oh, but the article references a draft report from the Trump Administration Department of Justice Inspector General? “To its authors in the Trump administration, the child separation policy was justified in the name of inflicting such EMOTIONAL TRAUMA on migrant families that further illegal crossing of the southern border would be DETERRED..
    That was the clear takeaway from the report of the Justice Department’s inspector general, a draft of which was reviewed by the New York Times. The report, whose final contours are unlikely to change significantly, paints a stomach-wrenching portrait of indifference and indecency on the part of U.S. officials. In the end, the policy was abandoned only when Americans, in overwhelming numbers, expressed their outrage at images and accounts of children torn from their families.” And the facts were filed in a court of law? Well…..we can’t know the truth. Damn liberals.

  151. Anon says:

    Mike E,

    You betcha.

    Stinkin’ liberals. Stinkin’ Washington Post.


  152. Babylon’s Dread says:


    What I edit out are the personal attacks. And I did exactly as you suggested – I had a good day – as soon as I got offline. I’ll have another today. All day.

  153. Dave says:

    Michael, BD, et all…

    I’ll confess outright, that I’ve become so intensely cynical and suspicious of legacy media platforms, that I hold little-no regard for any. Too many Project Veritas-like exposes’ reveal the agenda driven Politico-Media Industrial Complex …selectively editing interviews, inserting unrelated video footage, and ripping words out of context to influence a predetermined audience sentiment.

    How many lives and dreams were destroyed or lost amongst the shattered, smoldering urban ruins left behind by protestors …whom the MSM persisted in characterizing as ‘peaceful and harmless’.

    The protective ‘coddling’ shown toward the swamp’s preferred candidate, versus the strident, antagonistic demeanor shown the opposition, during recent presidential debates/town halls was unsurprising …but despicably prejudiced nonetheless.

    There are still folks that seem to believe the ‘Steele Dossier’ (“Russia, Russia, Russia”) is a legitimately credible treasure trove of foreign intelligence gathering, rather than a deep state manufactured coup attempt bankrolled by Democratic Party operatives, seeking to overthrow a duly elected POTUS. Jeez, how many millions of dollars was spent on debunking that, yet the MSM continues to insulate ‘their candidate’ from answering Burisma-related “quid-pro-quo” questioning, while pretending to ignore that man’s synapse-malfunctioning cognitive disability.

    Before eventually reaching terminal disgust/distrust of all MSM outlets; I previously had appreciation for Fox News, serving as a right wing counter-weight to help offset the intrenched leverage of MSNBC & CNN, but as I understand it …it too, has recently veered from the ‘right’ lane, and taken a hard left.

    Now, I look to a diverse variety of current issue commentators whom have shown themselves to be fair minded and with sufficient humility to admit when wrong.

  154. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    Dave, can you name a few you are listening to who are fair minded?
    I on the other hand trust none of them, but am happier to be lied to by “my guys” vs being lied to by “their guys”. 🙂

  155. Mike E. says:

    His name is Gerson Rodriguez. He is 10 years old. SAY HIS NAME! His mom’s name is Sandra. SAY HER NAME! Oh, but this is from the lefty’s at the New York Times. Well, we must ignore and deny it then. Perhaps Gerson and his mother are “crisis actors,” paid for by the evil Jew George Soros. *sigh* We can’t know the truth anymore. *Yawn.* Back to my nice warm bed now. Michael, if you ever want to go to Juarez, I’ll get a passport.

  156. Em says:

    We look for boogies left and right? Could be red herrings to keep us from seeing what’s really goin on.. Could be….
    Question: Are we looking at an international move toward globalism under the guise of eliminating conflicts, wars? Could be…. Dunno, though, do i ?
    Keep looking, maybe “up?”. 😇

  157. Jean says:

    “Question: Are we looking at an international move toward globalism…?”

    Why is it a guise? What is the problem with globalism?

    Do we live on a globe?
    Do we trade internationally?
    Do the actions of other countries affect us and us them?
    Can we enjoy peace at home if the world’s on fire?
    Do we benefit from trade and arms control treaties?
    Do we go to war alone or with allies?

  158. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    Em, we do not have globalism — we have American stupidism.
    If we are going to have true globalism we need to have the cost and the allied troop strengths even across the board.
    All nations should pay an equal amount, based on their GDP towards their defense and all nation’s troop strengths should be based as a percent of population.

    The US needs to bring all our troops home and we need to cut our defense budget by 1/3rd (a savings of almost $250 billion per year – that we can put into our healthcare and education) and require the “allied nations” to pick up the slack out of their own piggybank.

    I can accept that type of globalism.

  159. Em says:

    One other thing, Jean and MLD….
    As i buy dispensationalism, a global governance sets things up for an easy takeover by an antichrist….
    Jean, your punch list forgets one thing… Genesis 11

  160. Jean says:

    “As i buy dispensationalism, a global governance sets things up for an easy takeover by an antichrist….”

    People buy all kinds of things. I can’t help you with that.

  161. Em says:

    Time will tell, Jean, time will tell….
    No, you can’t help me, nor i you. 😏
    I’m good whichever interpretation turns out to be correct, but i don’t have a reputation for being easily fooled. . So?
    Time will tell…. ⏳

  162. Dread says:



  163. josh hamrick says:

    “a global governance sets things up for an easy takeover by an antichrist….”

    MLD has already told us that is Francis in this very thread 🙂

  164. Muff Potter says:

    Quite simply, Michael loves the Lord. As does Xenia. Like us all, imperfect servants.
    I have serious doubts that the Almighty requires perfection, I’ve come to the belief that if you’re doing the best you can with what you’re given, you’re okay.

  165. Dread says:

    Salvation by good intentions.

  166. josh hamrick says:

    “Salvation by good intentions.”

    Yes, God’s good intentions 🙂

  167. Michael says:

    “I’ve come to the belief that if you’re doing the best you can with what you’re given, you’re okay.”

    I concur.

  168. josh hamrick says:

    Doesn’t the crucifixion seem a little brutal to then just be like “But hey, you can get there another way as long as you are nice about it”?

  169. Em says:

    Good intentions may carry some water for those who’ve never been exposed to the Gospel, but those intentions cannot overrule Acts 4:10-12
    Agreeing with Muff that in our flesh, we cannot reach anything near perfection – thus the need for a Redeemer, conceived by the Holy Spirit in the womb of a virgin
    Hey, Satan, there is one complete triune God and no room for another. 😇 hiding at the foot of His cross as i type

  170. Michael says:


    “Doesn’t the crucifixion seem a little brutal to then just be like “But hey, you can get there another way as long as you are nice about it”?”

    Absolutely…if anyone gets home it will be because of the person and work of Jesus.
    When they discover that is another question…

  171. Nancy Holmes says:

    Touche, Josh–touche…

  172. Michael says:

    We have too many groups to deal with to be really dogmatic.
    The billions who never heard.
    The mentally ill and incapacitated.
    Those who the church abused into unbelief in order to survive.

    We can condemn them all to eternal hell.
    We can write it off to mystery.
    We can magnify the entire person and work of Jesus Christ who desires all men to be saved and thus died for the world.
    I’m resting in the third choice…

  173. Em says:

    Michael @ 12:55. AMEN

  174. Jean says:

    Since others are sharing their views, this is the Gospel I believe in:

    “Now it is evident that no one is justified before God by the law, for “The righteous shall live by faith.” But the law is not of faith, rather “The one who does them shall live by them.” Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us—for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who is hanged on a tree”— so that in Christ Jesus the blessing of Abraham might come to the Gentiles, so that we might receive the promised Spirit through faith.”
    ‭‭Galatians‬ ‭3:11-14‬ ‭ESV‬‬

    By the law, I include “doing the best one can.”

    By Gospel, I believe there is only one.

  175. Em says:

    Jean, amen
    But the question hangs in the air, “What if you never heard the Gospel msg?”
    The only answer i have found is that God sees and knows hearts… He knows how the ignorant would respond to the Truth. God be merciful to this sinner…. Or that’s a bunch of bull !

  176. Dread says:

    “When they discover that is another question…”

    Does that hint at post-mortem faith?

    I’m pretty sure it doesn’t apply to universal redemption as I’ve seen plenty of damnation ascribed to offenders.

    I’m just curious as to how far from Calvin and Packer the PP might have traversed.

    Also “we can condemn them all to an eternal hell” is unlikely to apply to this crowd.

  177. Dread says:


    Agnosticism is ok on varied subjects. Since none of us is the final arbiter of another’s redemption we simply continue to announce Christ and invite faith.

    I think there are threads of insight here and there but the apostolic mandate was to carry the message and the church is being intimidated from that task by all kinds of nonsense ideas.

  178. Jean says:


    Last week we discussed the definitions of “conservative” vs. “liberal.” In the field of theology, where I would define myself as “conservative,” one of the traits of conservative theology (speaking only for myself) is that we do not construct or confess doctrines taught or promoted by Word-less spirits.

    The merciful God we have is the One revealed in Scripture. Long ago, at many times and in many ways, God spoke to our fathers by the prophets, but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed the heir of all things, through whom also he created the world.

    The only doctrine I trust, which I pin my hope, my future, and my teaching on, is that revealed in the revealed, written Word. Everything else about God that He works in creation, the rising of the Sun, the changing of the seasons, the earthquakes and hurricanes, the bountiful harvests and the raging pandemics, I just stand in awe, adore and glorify God in.

  179. Duane Arnold says:

    “… the church is being intimidated from that task by all kinds of nonsense ideas.”

    Really? Not really sure that I’ve seen that phenomena…

  180. Jean says:


    No intimidation here either.

  181. Duane Arnold says:


    No… but a good bit of nonsense 😁

  182. Jean says:

    “Trump’s attempt to hijack our faith for votes, and the evangelical leaders’ silence on his actions and behavior, has presented a picture of what our faith looks like — that’s so erroneous it’s done significant damage to the way people view Jesus”.

    Jerushah Duford

  183. Dread. I don’t see an abandonment of Calvin. Some held to him, because as Spurgeon said, Calvinism is the Gospel.( or something to that effect)
    As for others, doctrine went flying out the window in 2016.

    But, I doubt Nine Marks, GC and the like dumped doctrine. They just know when to shut up and get out of the tracks when the runaway train is going through town. Nobody is listening to doctrine right now. When the train is gone, doctrine will be back.

  184. Jean says:

    “When a leader models self-absorbed, self-exalting boastfulness, he models the most deadly behavior in the world. He points his nation to destruction. Destruction of more kinds than we can imagine.

    “I think Roe is an evil decision. I think Planned Parenthood is a code name for baby-killing and (historically at least) ethnic cleansing. And I think it is baffling and presumptuous to assume that pro-abortion policies kill more people than a culture-saturating, pro-self pride.

    “It is naive to think that a man can be effectively pro-life and manifest consistently the character traits that lead to death — temporal and eternal.”

    John Piper

  185. Dread says:

    Not all intimidation is physical

    Today it only requires a manipulation of sensibilities.

    Note that I said “by all kinds of nonsense ideas”
    Such as the idea that our good intentions is what God is looking for.

    Such as the idea of universal redemption

    Such as the idea that evangelism is imperialism

    Here’s a guy confronting nonsense ideas

    “We receive all kinds of messages telling us why evangelism is wrong:

    You are only trying to manipulate people for selfish purposes.
    You will corrupt or show disdain for people’s culture.
    You are being intolerant of people’s beliefs.
    You are arrogantly assuming that you are better than everyone else.
    You are not honoring individuals as unique persons.”

    BTW I’m not fussed by the millennials in Barna’s study— just by the spirit of the age

    Had a chance to witness to a guy in the shower the other day. He was wide open. 😳

    Hold on to your knickers guys —- he was a plumber fixing a shower head.

    Anyway evangelism matters on earth as in heaven. Let’s do more of it.

  186. bob1 says:

    “… the church is being intimidated from that task by all kinds of nonsense ideas.”


    Folks on here care about God and His ways.

    But this definitely isn’t a “swallow and follow” site.


  187. Dread says:


    I’m no Calvinist and if you note that was a question not an accusation. I don’t care I’m just looking for correlation.

  188. Em says:

    All, i have often thought that the Church might be too relaxed in spreading the Gospel – the Truth revealed in Scripture, Jean. That hasn’t always been the case, but since the fear of God is the beginning of wisdom, lately we may have emphasized His love at the expense of His holiness.
    Does God compromise? My take is that He can’t … Sending His son to earth to die? That says there is a line that can’t be crossed….
    Heck, i can’t even get my mind around a universe of non colliding planets. Our sun, that ball of perfectly placed fire? WOW
    Lots of good points to ponder in this string of posts… Hope all of us are.
    Pastor Dread, thanks for the 12:06

  189. Dread, I realize your not. I just think the serious Calvinist are just keeping quiet until this passes.

  190. Dread says:

    So none of you guys see the reticence to evangelize these days?

    And my bringing up that the spirit of the age is against evangelism and has people backed down offends you all?

    Don’t people need to know the LORD?

    Don’t you guys want to share the joy of Jesus?

    What sort of site IS this?

    And Bob1

    Are you suggesting that mentioning evangelism means I don’t care about God and his ways?

  191. Michael says:


    I affirm the creeds of the early church without reservation.
    I enjoy ongoing conversations with theologians from both the East and West, living and dead.
    I enjoy discussing both the potential of universal reconciliation and the reality of hell.
    I do neither online because online, nuance and thoughtfulness are not our friends.

  192. Jean says:

    So none of you guys see the reticence to evangelize these days?

    “And my bringing up that the spirit of the age is against evangelism and has people backed down offends you all?” The spirit of the age has always been against evangelism and nothing currently is unusual.

    “Don’t people need to know the LORD? “Yes they do.

    “Don’t you guys want to share the joy of Jesus?” Yes I do.

    The worst thing that can happen to the church and her witness is to (1) seize secular power, (2) get in bed with secular power, or (3) acquiesce to secular power.

    The church’s power is made perfect in weakness.

    The church does not “wrestle against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the cosmic powers over this present darkness, against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly places.”

    “Blessed are you when others revile you and persecute you and utter all kinds of evil against you falsely on my account. Rejoice and be glad, for your reward is great in heaven, for so they persecuted the prophets who were before you.”

    My suggestion is that Christians really need to be on guard and do their best to shake off the Dominion theology making its rounds in American Christianity today.

  193. Michael says:

    I don’t think there’s a reticence to evangelize…it’s just taken a backseat to politics by those most committed to it…

  194. Em says:

    Just ponder hell a bit… Do we believe it is real? Do we believe that God said that He was not willing that any should perish???
    Sobering reality… I should be out running up and down my street yelling, “Hell is real, but God has provided a way out!”. .
    probably have one of these hunters run over me in his pickup. Would that count as dying for the Faith???
    Here i am sitting on a sofa …. 🙆…. Is prayer enough??? Ponder, ponder, ponder

  195. bob1 says:

    Are you suggesting that mentioning evangelism means I don’t care about God and his ways?

    1) I wasn’t addressing this to you.
    2) Stop being so damn defensive. Good grief.

  196. Dread says:


    You quoted me and add ??


    I hardly call that a leap of logic.

  197. Michael says:

    Dread had one stuck…further up the thread.

  198. bob1 says:

    Just because I pulled your quote doesn’t mean my comment was directed to you. It was directed to everyone on here.

    Check your own logic.

    You know what assuming does, don’t you?

  199. Dread says:

    It means we’re both asses

    I accept

  200. Duane Arnold says:

    “What sort of site IS this?”

    The nonsense continues…

  201. Anon says:

    I guess everything’s that’s wrong in our country is pretty much the fault of an individual who hasn’t been president for nearly four years.

  202. Em says:

    Anon, say what?

  203. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    Michael @ 12:47 yesterday. — I think you have your roads and gates confused — wide vs narrow.
    I don’t think Jesus was talking like he had marbles in his mouth so we could not understand.

    Also, those abused by the church into unbelief? The parable of the sower spoke of those who fall away for the cares of the world.

  204. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    Also, I think the rich young man was “doing his best with what he had” and Jesus said no way Jose – my way or the highway. (MLD paraphrase 2020 edition)

  205. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    One last thing and then I need to get ready to lead my men’s group – “do your best and God will do the rest is Mormon theology.

  206. Michael says:

    Charles Bowden died in 2016.
    The last story he finished had been twenty five years in the making…the story of how the U.S. was complicit in the death of DEA agent Kiki Camerena.
    Now, the U.S. is using his work to prosecute the guilty on the Mexican side.

    Bowden’s final masterpiece is here;

    St. Bowden, indeed…

  207. Michael says:

    A “proof text” and an accusation of Mormon theology…”I do neither online because online, nuance and thoughtfulness are not our friends.”…

  208. Mike E. says:

    Michael…I usually take up stuff you recommend. But I’ve never read Bowden, even with all your recommendations. I didn’t realize he was a journalist. Thought he was a theologian or something to be honest. Having been trained in investigative journalism myself (forever ago), this piques my interest in him and his writings. Once again, my friend, I owe you. God has really used your ministry in my life in a powerful way. Thanks for your ongoing faithfulness and service, brother.

  209. Michael says:

    Mike E,

    Bowden hated the term “journalist”.
    He always said he was a “reporter”…he reported the things he saw so people would know the truth.
    He is still the last word on all thing Mexico and the “war on drugs”.
    He was not a Christian…he was at times an alcoholic and a womanizer, a man committed to the sensual in all things.
    More than anything, he was brutally honest and committed to truth…he ruined himself telling the stories of violence and poverty.
    He died basically penniless and tired…people do not want to hear truth.
    He was, and is, a hero to me.
    I do not suggest you read much of him…one does not escape Chuck unscathed.
    His classic “Down By The River” is what I do suggest if you want to know the truth behind Mexico and the drug war and so much more.
    It took him seven years to write and left him bankrupt.
    His example of perseverance is why this blog is still here.
    Thank you for your kindness and constant support. Mike.
    It has mattered and still does.

  210. Update on my comment upthread:
    Looks like Piper has repositioned himself for a Trump crash. Piper will be attacked, but his brand has such a huge focus on sin and sexuality, its makes sense to protect his ethical consistency and reputation. There’s a time and place for everything. This might be a good time to run, not walk from Trumpism.

  211. Em says:

    Total rabbit trail.
    I mentioned wanting to make a $$ contribution here that wouldn’t process.. I use Firefox these days for web browsing. When i went back to Chrome there was no problem…
    Just an FYI, in case I’m not the only one

    Bowdon, reminds me that so many don’t understand that it isn’t overcoming sin that keeps one from redemption. Nor is this corrupted world evidence of an uncaring creator – or no creator…. My dearest, most caring uncle, a big player in the corporate world (they didn’t used to all be barracudas) couldn’t see evidence of a creator, let alone a plan of redemption, because he could only see the evil. We were friends and to this day i feel guilt for not persevering more in prayer and witness to him…
    Do we listen to wrong voices in our heads? I know that sometimes i do…. sigh

  212. pstrmike says:

    a little prickly there dread?

    I was just having some good natured fun with you……..

    have a beer and relax


  213. Mike E. says:

    Hey MLD…”He’ll Take Care of the Rest” by Keith Green is one of my favorite Christian pop/rock songs. Do you have to spoil everything? 😉

  214. Mike E. says:

    Michael…I thank you. I highly value our friendship. I also appreciate your warning about being scathed. I’ve been scathed a lot. I don’t want to be scathed any more than God would require of me.

  215. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    Mike E. so that it doesn’t ruin the song – make it “I do absolutely nothing and he’ll take care of the rest.” -)

  216. Dave says:


    I should have offered specifics on sources of current events commentators I’ve regularly enjoyed checking in with. YT channels like: Rubin Report, Epoch Times, ABL, Bongino Report, Larry Elder, Michele Malkin, Candace Owens and Timcast.

    I find it curiously ironic that I am drawn to the meekness I detect in Rubin, he comes across as humble, still learning. Perhaps it’s residuals of invisible scars borne from rejection of his chosen lifestyle.

    Hearing two highly intelligent women of Asian & Black heritage (Malkin, Owens) dissect and analyze cultural trends or noteworthy events, offers insights with nuance …I’d have missed, left on my own.

    Several of these folks are formerly of a politically liberal bent, but experienced their own version of an epiphany, and moved center of ideological boundaries.

    If Shapiro modeled some meekness and compassion (and talked slower) …I’d probably hang out for awhile.

    PS: ( I struggled to resist a mischievous temptation to list Alex Jones or the 700 Club 😁)

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