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28 Responses

  1. Jtk says:


    I wonder if online discernment ministries get cranky, weird and one-sided BECAUSE they aren’t building a local church they way local churches have been built for 2,000 years.

    We both have a passion for justice, for righting the wrongs, but we both work hard at pouring our lives into other real world people (family, but especially with real people we look in the eyes regularly).

    THAT is one thing I think keeps us “balanced” and gives us focus.

    Just a theory–thoughts?

    As I move on to read about Driscoll and SGM.

  2. Michael says:


    Good thoughts…I think the ODM’s suffer from isolationism intellectually and spiritually.
    There is a big difference between para church ministries and the life of a local church.

  3. Nonnie says:

    ODM’s and “Real time discernments ministries” (live speaking engagements) are surrounded with “groupies” that flock from place to place to hear them, buy their books, DVDs, etc. Their audiences love what they are saying and enjoy the feeling of superiority over the rest of Christ’s bride…..they want and demand more and more from their discernment gurus.

    ‘Cranky” can be interpreted as “upset, grieved, passionate” about the false teaching that he/she is fighting against.
    My 2 cents worth.

  4. Michael says:


    You nailed it…

  5. jtk says:

    The other link for the antiBible atheist monument was busted.

    I’d go there.
    I bet Paul would’ve too.

    I find Jesus and what He said stands up nicely in the face of atheism and other thoughts that express that we are little more than cosmic accidents, and our nastiest desires should be exalted.

  6. Crowned1 says:

    Check out the latest tripe popular media is trying to sell kids:

    “We are all God in drag”

    Love, Chuck Lorre of Big Bang Theory renown

    We are the change. We don’t need God’s help, we ARE God. 🙁

  7. covered says:

    Syrian Christians… I was blessed to be able to spend some time last year with Syrian believers who have fled to Lebanon and Amman. The stories will tear your hearts out and their only crime is believing that Jesus Christ is the Messiah. We were able to coordinate a “retreat” for a pastor and his family who fled Syria because their 8 yr old sons school bus was blown up on the way to school. The govt. thought this pastor’s son was on that bus but he wasn’t. This pastor and his family fled to N. Lebanon and we were able to host his entire staff to meet this pastor, wife and son at a retreat center we rented for 2 days. His staff endured check points and interrogations as they made their way into Damascus to meet us 30 minutes from the border. As we sat back and watched and listened to all of their stories, one thought, one story came up with every staff member, every worship team member, childrens ministry worker and various staff members and that thought was how good God is! They were blessing Jesus for His love and allowing them to sit together and eat and pray together as a family (church family).

    They talked about the war and unrest as just something that is. They believe that persecution is the norm. The way it caused them to bond and love each other and love Jesus was perhaps the most humbling thing I have ever witnessed in God’s church.

    We capped off the last night with an amazing Lebanese dinner and heard stories of how God is working in each of their lives. Finally when it was time to call it a night, they asked a favor. They asked their pastor who had to leave his country for the safety of his bride and son what he missed most about each one of his staff members. As he cited to each family member what he misses most about them and shared stories and acknowledged each ones gifts, I was undone. I thank God that He called me to be a pastor but I am no where near the pastor He called me to be.

    Real persecution serves a purpose and it’s painful. James would tell us to count it joy when he was addressing the tribes that were scattered abroad. All of it serves a purpose and while we don’t understand it or like it, God is glorified! He is good indeed.

  8. Michael says:


    Thank you for that.
    We need to hear these stories…but we really don’t want to listen.
    Help me keep this in front of those with ears to hear.

  9. Nonnie says:

    It boggles the mind that western governments are giving money or promoting the giving of money to groups (armies) that are causing such violence against Christians, as well as others in their own religion, in the name of their religion. Why would the US and UK support these haters?

  10. covered says:

    Nonnie, when we pulled out of Iraq, there were around 35 registered evangelical churches in Iraq. A conservative estimate was probably 30k believer’s. Now with no Americans to stop the murder, kidnapping etc, many of the pastor’s are leaving as their families are being threatened. This leaves many sheep without a shepherd and it won’t stop until every known pastor is killed or run out of the country. When you look at the numbers, the body counts aren’t high enough to act on or for our liberal media to report. Now, if this were happening to our Muslim brothers and sisters, it would be remedied right away. It is what it is.

  11. Anne says:

    In the US, I would dare say , many of the “faithful” represented in congress and throughout the nation, sadly do not consider Orthodox Christians to be “real” christians. Thus the grievous lack of widespread concern or uproar, IMO.

  12. Anne says:

    Reports you won’t see in mainstream US media:
    I have given up on mainstream corporate sponsored media for in depth news, but thankful for the many journalists here and worldwide still working to tackle the hard stories.

  13. Anne says:

    covered – it is happening to “our muslim brothers & sisters”. The different sects and regional tribes are slaughtering each other in even greater numbers last time I checked.

    Also, from my seat in the peanut gallery, both liberal and conservative media wonks seem to have the same blind spot when it comes to this issue.

  14. Anne said “wonks.” I love that word, but I can never remember to use it.

  15. covered says:

    Anne, my issue is that the numbers of believer’s are diminishing at a rate that soon there will be none in these regions of the Middle East. I also believe that because Christians are hated by so many, that the truth will never be reported. I haven’t checked statistics on Muslims being persecuted but if it were so, we would hear more about it. It just seems that Christians are much more expendable in the Middle East.

  16. Muff Potter says:

    Anne wrote:

    The different sects and regional tribes are slaughtering each other in even greater numbers last time I checked.

    Also, from my seat in the peanut gallery, both liberal and conservative media wonks seem to have the same blind spot when it comes to this issue.

    Christianity also has a long history of its sects slaughtering each other. The most recent historical incidents were in Northern Ireland. In my opinion the labels “liberal” & “conservative” have little meaning in the major media outlets. They are no longer in the business of informing the populace but rather in ensuring that they are cowed consumers who will buy more stuff hawked by their corpocracy overlords.

  17. Dude says:

    PRESS ……NEWSPAPERS ? I havent seen a real paper in years.
    I recomend that you save your old NY Times and other papers and cut them into 4 by 6 pieces and store them away.When the country defaults and Americas economy dies the first item that will disapear will be the T P stockpiles. Just saying

  18. Tim says:

    Mohler brought out some interesting arguments about the inherent conflict between a straightfoward interpretation of the Biblical text and Darwinian evolution, but he took a long time to get to the initial question & then side-stepped it with one of the weaker arguments: the universe is old because God made it look old.

    I really wish he would have delved more into the more substantial arguments on the matter. He had already alluded to the evolutionist’s dependency upon uniformity, and that would have been a natural jumping-off point. Nor did he give much credence to the universal effects of the fall, the underlying assumption that all positions start with presuppositions, etc.

    Oh well. It wasn’t my lecture to give.

  19. Tim says:

    Re: newspapers…

    I find they are very useful, especially for starting my hardwood charcoal when I’m barbecuing. 😉

  20. Steve Wright says:

    I don’t think the earth looks old at all. Galaxies and outer space is a different matter but as far as the earth goes, looks quite young.

  21. I was working in the garden the other day and I put some young earth around the roses.

  22. Jtk says:

    Can someone give me a summation of the “non-young earth” theory?

    Other than the traditional secular view?

    Never discussed in my neighborhood…

  23. PP Vet says:

    There are many different old earth views.

    Obviously, there was judgement and death on earth before the Garden. The geological and paleontological evidence is overwhelming.

    Presumably these were judgments in response to the actions of the enemy, who apparently was on earth, and fallen.

    The Garden was planted in the midst of that, and our ancestors were assigned to “subdue” it.

    This is consistent with how God works: intervening redemptively in the midst of chaos.

    This view is consistent with the scientific evidence and the scripture. I cannot find another view that makes sense of both.

  24. Just a quick comment here, ’cause the “God Points a Finger” prompted me to write out my own thoughts on this. I heard it in sermon some time ago, but it stuck with me.

  25. Gary says:

    MLD #21 LOL! That was great.

  26. I appreciate the annihilationist article… I have held that position for many years and do not see any reason to abandon it

  27. Ian Elsasser says:

    I’m with Dread on the conditionalist/annihilationist Q&A; I think Fudge answered concisely and clearly but also pastorally as evident in his reply to Julia. His books The Fire That Consumes (more technical yet accessible) and Hell: A Final Word (non technical and very accessible) are worth reading if you can get your hands on them.

    Dead, regarding conditional immortality, do you hold to ‘soul sleep’ as well as annihilation or just the latter? There is differences of opinion by conditionalists about the intermediate state.

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