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64 Responses

  1. OCDan says:

    EM,

    I love your comment from yesterday regarding His grace and Holiness vs. our lack of grace and limitations. When viewed in light of Michael’s articles regarding how we demonize others, it is truly amazing.

    Think about how there is only one unforgivable sin that Jesus mentions and it really is incredible who God is.

    I also like Bowden’s comment about being more while having less. The older I get the more this resonates with me.

  2. Em says:

    God keep all safe thru the wildfire that has blown up in California… can’t help but feel that You are trying to get our attention, Lord

  3. Em says:

    OCDan, it was j2 yesterday who observed that grace is shown by holding someone accountable, and someone elaborated: by having the honesty that Nathan had with David and then by being there for them… lot of food for thought yesterday 🙂

  4. Paul A. Lytton says:

    I am well aware that there are very few people who read copies of my posts that actually give a flying cow patty for my self intended revelations… Regardless….., here I go again.

    It appears to me that the vast majority of Christian preachers have multiple different ways to address what much of the things written in the Bible actually mean. However, there is one subject that I have lately been observing where a lot of them seem to agree, (that in and of itself should cause me to take heed).

    The topic I am referring to here is Salvation being of “Grace Alone”. I totally agree with the fact that there is nothing that man can do himself alone to cause his own Salvation and that it is only by the Grace of Christ that it is made available. But many Preachers, of many different denominations, seem to think that if a person says that they were saved when they gave themselves to Christ they are actually depending on doing something themselves to become Saved and this thought should be frowned upon.

    In my opinion, that is taking it a little bit too far. For me to say/think that I must choose to accept the offer of Christ’s Grace is in no means the same thing as me saying/thinking my works have anything to do with my salvation. If the way I hear these pastors preaching Grace Alone were true, everyone would be saved. Jesus said that the road is wide and the gate is narrow, meaning that not all are saved.

    God gave us the right to choose. Mankind chose to listen to, and have faith in, what the serpent said and because of that, mankind was separated from God. Now mankind can choose to have faith in what Christ said and that is how man will reunite with God. God does not force Himself upon us, we have to make a decision to accept his offer or not.

    However you define it, mankind must make a choice and that choice is a part of salvation without disrespecting Grace. Do these pastors not understand that Grace Alone is the ‘offer’ of salvation, but it also comes with a ‘requirement’?

    Or is the idea of a person making the personal decision of accepting Christ to be defined by, and taught by, the unknowingly deceived pastors as self works merely a Satanic inspired stepping stone towards trying to cause people to stop personally committing themselves to Christ?

  5. Michael says:

    Paul,

    I do not find the concept of “free will” in the Scriptures.
    What I see is man dead in sins and trespasses, in bondage to sin, and unable to free himself without the sovereign actions of a gracious God.

    Grace that requires anything is not grace, but reward.

  6. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    This is where the theology of glory begins. Two people in church hearing the same message – one gets saved and the other not. Why, what is the difference??? My decision.

    God didn’t save – God didn’t convert – no, the active force at work in my salvation is my decision / choice / acceptance.

    The theology of glory? God is please with my decision.

  7. Em says:

    hmmm.. “My sheep hear my voice …” is “having ears to hear” a work? … i’m taking snatches of Scripture as i recall them, not necessarily building one off of the other … i think that ‘faith’ is a response, not a human work of either justification or sanctification… it is simply a response and it may be one that carries emotion – one of sorrow or shame or joy or even strength and resolve (maybe it should be the latter)… “take my yoke and learn….” “search the Scriptures”… “let this mind be in you which was in Christ…” is focus a work? … thinking, thinking…

    #4 -“For me to say/think that I must choose to accept the offer of Christ’s Grace is in no means the same thing as me saying/thinking my works have anything to do with my salvation.” if ‘choose’ were to equate with ‘respond,’ then i am agreeing with Paul L.

  8. Michael says:

    How can the dead respond?

    Jesus said you must be born from above to even see the kingdom of God.

    I other words christ must make you alive, give you eyes to see and ears to hear, and then he even gives you the faith to believe.

    Salvation is of the Lord.

  9. Steve Wright says:

    I see the use of faith, in the context of salvation, used in Scripture – with rebuking by Jesus for not having it.

  10. Em says:

    Michael, i see what you are saying… 🙂

    that said, God isn’t arbitrary in His call, is He? i’m coming from the view that man comes into this world with a body and a soul and a dead or non-existant spirit… isn’t there something in that soul that God knows will respond? that will say, “yes, Lord?”

  11. Michael says:

    Em,

    What would be in the soul that God didn’t put there?
    Is God arbitrary?
    If you’re meaning does He choose, the answer is yes.

    Calling it arbitrary is a pejorative meaning that somehow humans can make better choices than God, that humans are more fair than God, and humans are somehow wiser and kinder than God.

    It assumes that there are some who would love to be chosen but God passed them over.

    None of these hold any water for me….there is a mystery in election and I don’t understand it, nor am I supposed to on this side of eternity.

  12. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    To play off of Steve’s comment about faith. Faith is given only through the hearing of God’s word. Everyone who hears Gods word is given faith. It is what is done with that faith is what matters. Man’s natural inclination is to reject. Left to its own faith works conversion…by itself.

  13. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    Michael and I would differ here. Although we both would say God saves alone with absolutely no input from the person, we would disagree about particular and arbitrary.

    I see the sower tossing his seed where he will and everyone and anyone get exposed to saving faith. The seed is equal opportunity effective, ho2ever some seed takes and some doesn’t. See the parable of the sower.

  14. Steve Wright says:

    MLD – if that last paragraph is what you really believe, then you and I are in 100% agreement

  15. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    Steve- I will accept your Lutheran confession – but that is not the normal arminian position which says you must first receive the seed and then do something with it.

  16. Em says:

    i agree that God in NOT arbitrary and therefore there has to be, for Him, something that He knows/sees in some men’s souls that will respond to His voice

    faith comes by hearing… does that mean that everyone who hears responds in faith? or, as it seems to me, The Faith only develops AFTER hearing His call and only after being born again (from above)…

  17. Michael says:

    “something that He knows/sees in some men’s souls that will respond to His voice”
    How about something He creates?

    I hope God is “arbitrary” in the sense that He chooses and His choices are irrevocable… because if I hadn’t been drafted, I sure as hell would never have volunteered…

    I’m offline for the weekend now…

  18. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    In the Lutheran world faith is the means 8n which on is capable of grasping Gods gift of salvation. No one is saved by faith.

    Since it is football season , try this – faith is the pine tar receivers used to put on their hands.

  19. WenatcheeTheHatchet says:

    i.e. Michael, MLD demonstrated that not all monergists are monergists in the same way? 🙂

    BTW, couldn’t not comment that yesterday was the birthday of Arvo Part, one of my favorite living composers.

  20. Em says:

    “what would be in a soul that God didn’t put there?” that is an interesting ponder… perhaps, He put “it” there in the DNA of the first living human being? … perhaps, it is a diluted, but redeemable gene or some such … dunno … He did, though, He knew from Day one how this all is going to play out even to the last cheep of every sparrow… an amazing, and unfathomable Being – thank You, Father for Jesus and thank You, Father for The Christ, our Redeemer, otherwise this poor Gentile wouldn’t have had a clue, let alone become a new life IN Christ

  21. Em says:

    “Since it is football season , try this – faith is the pine tar receivers used to put on their hands.” faith is sticky stuff? God, could i have maple syrup instead?

  22. Paul A. Lytton says:

    Michael @ # 5 says, “I do not find the concept of “free will in the Scriptures.”

    Josh 24:15 – And if it is evil in your eyes to serve the Lord, ‘CHOOSE’ this day whom you will serve, whether the gods your fathers served in the region beyond the River, or the gods of the Amorites in whose land you dwell. But as for me and my house, we will serve the Lord.

    (This clearly states we have a ‘choice’ of the god we serve or not)
    _______________________________________________________________________

    Rev 3:20 – Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and eat with him, and he with me.

    (why would it say if anyone hears my voice AND opens the door if the one hearing the voice does not have the ‘choice’ to open the door or not?)
    _______________________________________________________________________

    2tim 2:26 – And they may come to their senses and escape from the snare of the devil, after being captured by him to do his will.

    (Is not coming to your senses and escaping from the devil a ‘choice’ to turn towards God?)
    _______________________________________________________________________

    Psalm 37:23 – The steps of a man are established by the Lord, when he delights in his way;

    (Is being delighted not a natural, human ‘choice’? Do I not ‘choose’ to be delighted in eating ice cream as apposed to being delighted in putting my hand in fire?)
    ________________________________________________________________________

    This is only four of 50+ at http://www.openbible.info/topics/free_will

    How does making any of these choices diminish Grace?

    Michael also said, “Grace that requires anything is not grace, but reward”

    Accepting grace is not receiving a reward anymore than drinking a glass of water offered to you is working for the water.

    For the life of me I can not understand how such highly informed Preachers can not see
    that accepting Grace of Salvation is required, but has absolutely nothing to do with
    working for that Salvation.

    God bless you all, but don’t forget if you accept His blessings you have received a reward for your works and
    not His Grace????

  23. Paul A. Lytton says:

    I have one in moderation due to Bible verses.

  24. Michael says:

    Paul,

    I don’t believe those verses mean what you think they mean.
    The ability to make a choice dies does mean that the will is free or enabled to make a Godward choice.
    People who are spiritually dead make bad choices .
    Jesus is standing at the the door of a church, not someone’s heart… so far only a few churches have let Him in.
    If I’m one of those highly informed preachers you speak of it’s because I believe the whole council of the Scriptures refutes your doctrine .

    I could go on, but I don’t care enough today to engage it.

  25. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    Luther spoke of the bound will. Man’s choice is always against God.
    Joshua was speaking to Jews already in the covenant with God. He was encouraging them to serve the one who was already their God.

  26. Em says:

    “people who are spiritually dead make bad choices,” yes, but what if it is the eternal soul that hears the call of God to come to Him? i don’t think i contributed much to my own birth, but once out of the cocoon, i inhaled and lived… it was a response, not a conscious decision on my part – i didn’t come into the world and make my first decision: the choice to breath…

    since, i see man born physically as a 2 part being, body and soul, it isn’t a stretch at all to see the soul as hearing God’s call and responding – my spiritual birth was a response not a “work” … why i responded, while i inhaled that sweet spiritual wind and lived and many of my gooder and smarter friends didn’t, God knows – just as He knows why He bothered to chase me down in the first place… there are much more civilized souls than mine out there

    just how it looks from here, how it makes sense to me, just sayin – again

  27. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    Em I go back to the theology of glory. The reason you are saved is because of an action on your part (even just a response) while the other guy is damned for lack of response.

    You leave out the whole doctrine of God converting people. He hasn’t converted someone if they must accept it.

    Man’s inate nature is to think they are one of the chefs in the kitchen.

  28. Paul A. Lytton says:

    Michael, this is my last word because it appears that my reasoning is not welcomed by you.

    But you said, “People who are spiritually dead make bad choices.”

    Mankind itself has been “spiritually dead” (separated from God) since Adam and Eve. That is why we need to be “Born Again”.

    Perhaps I do not comply my doctrine with the “whole council of the Scriptures” as you say you do, but in the scripture it does say, “For by grace you have been saved through FAITH. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast.”

    Where it says, “through faith” it is not implying to God’s faith, but to man’s faith.

    If mankind after Adam and Eve can have “faith” AND at the same time, makes bad choices because he is separated from God (Spiritually Dead) he obviously can choose between faith in Grace, or no faith in Grace.

    I stand on my mere point that my accepting “Grace” (saying I was saved when I accepted Christ) is NOT a “work” done by me (and I have faith in that), but it is a NECESSITY to be done by me in order to obtain my Salvation. And I pray someone reading this understands that so that they will not stop encouraging others to accept Grace, in a false fear that they would be encouraging others in committing a “work” for Salvation.

    But if you do agree with me.., do not say so here because Michael will think you too do not believe the whole council of the Scripture.

    Bye

  29. Michael says:

    Paul,

    I think that may be the first self refuting post here on the blog.
    You made my case.

    Man is dead and sins and must be born again before he can choose for God.

    By grace you have been saved by faith AND THIS IS NOT YOUR DOING IT IS THE GIFT OF GOD.

    Thank you…exactly what I was saying.

    What I said was that my understanding of the whole counsel of the Scriptures disagrees and refutes yours.
    I did not say that you did not believe the whole counsel of Scripture, so your whining is misplaced.

    Bye…bye.

  30. Em says:

    Martin Luther’s Disciple, i know you know and love God, His son and His word… i am glad you are at peace with the view that you have … perhaps, we’re not seeing eye to eye on this because of poor word choices … what i see you teaching is passivity to the point of puppetry and i know that’s not your view …
    i see us as responding and i don’t see the RESPONSE as a WORK at all … so the one thing we do agree on is that it is all of God – one way or another

    (and yes, the word is clear, i agree, faith IS a gifting from God, too)

    God keep

  31. Surfer51 says:

    “But many Preachers, of many different denominations, seem to think that if a person says that they were saved when they gave themselves to Christ they are actually depending on doing something themselves to become Saved and this thought should be frowned upon.”

    Romans 10:9

    If you confess…you shall be saved…

    http://biblehub.com/romans/10-9.htm

  32. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    Em – I think the original thought way up the thread was “accepting” – as in if I accept it, it is for me and belongs to me. But if I don’t accept it, it was not for me. In your view and Paul A’s, it becomes more like a contract entered into by 2 parties.

    We all respond – with the response given to us – by producing fruit. Read John 15 and you will see that even our response (our fruit) is not originated nor generated by us.

  33. Em says:

    ” In your view and Paul A’s, it becomes more like a contract entered into by 2 parties.” nope
    didn’t someone say something about ships that go ‘bump’ in the night?

    salvation IS a gift from God … i don’t care really whether i put out my hands and received it or He hung it around my neck… either way …
    but it is so much more than can be packaged or put on a chain… i thank Him for this truly unspeakable gift – unfathomable wisdom and grace of God – He is not willing that any perish, but He allows it – so when you think about it there IS a transaction between every man and His Creator – grace does have an expiration date…

    now i’m gone

  34. Bob says:

    Paul A

    “whole council of the Scripture”

    Typically what we really mean by this (when we quote such a thing) is, “I believe what I was taught by others is the “whole council of the Scripture.””

    Very few of us have the time to actually read, dissect, meditate on, learn the history of, memorize and more the scriptures. So most of us rely on what others have written (or tell us) on various subjects and that becomes our “whole council of the Scripture.”

    What is really too bad (not pointing at Michael here, because I have no idea how much he studies) is, most people read books, blogs and articles about the bible and rarely read more than the scripture byte given as proofs in them. If we read just the gospels every month our knowledge of God’s scriptures would grow.

    Just think if everyone made a point of just reading the bible every year. Wow, maybe our love for God would grow and mature!

  35. Michael says:

    Yea, Bob, you nailed me.
    Never read anything but the bottom of In-N-Out cups.

  36. Michael says:

    Before In-N – Out opened I preached using the Magic 8 ball…

  37. Michael says:

    Someday I hope I can join the ranks of the elite like you who have read Scriptures and studied history.
    I’ve preached every week for 21 years…think it’s too late to start?

  38. Bob says:

    Michael:

    It’s your blog and you have the right to be the rear end of a you know what. But, you might consider reading this again and see this:

    “(not pointing at Michael here, because I have no idea how much he studies) ”

    And since I never said I “have the whole counsel of scripture” anywhere in any posy I have ever written, your accusations reveal you are shooting first before considering the target,

    “Someday I hope I can join the ranks of the elite like you…:

    Dude what a thing to say!

    And considering in 11 days the work work mentioned in Hebrews (being taught on anther thread) is finished by Jesus, just saying..

    Captain Kirk, “Ready, fire!”

  39. Bob says:

    “And since I never said I “have the whole counsel of scripture” anywhere in any posy”

    correction:

    “And since I never said I “have the whole counsel of scripture” anywhere in any posts…”

    Dude, if you want posters to be fired up, just keep shooting.

  40. Bob says:

    Oh and MIchael, please refrain from this kind of stuff:

    “I’ve preached every week for 21 years…”

    Many have been at it longer, but maybe not every week.

    And, I really do mean this without any sarcasm or scorn, Thank you for your service. The world needs more, not less, preaching and teaching!

    Keep that part up!

    “… use a careful aim and slowly squeeze the trigger. The gun going off should be a surprise… you won’t miss the target.”

    😉

  41. Michael says:

    You come on my blog and insult me and think I’m going to sit here and take it.
    No, I’m not.

    I will try this again for those lacking in reading comprehension.

    I said I believed the whole counsel of Scripture refuted Pauls position.

    Meaning, that this incessant proof texting was ridiculous and I’ve been convinced otherwise because of the whole witness on the matter.

    Others may be convinced otherwise, but I’m sick and tired of people acting like they have a “gotcha” verse that takes down an entire systematic.

    If you don’t like what I do or how I do it…leave.

  42. Michael says:

    Bob,

    Shut up.
    The point is simple.
    No one preaches for over two decades without reading the Scriptures.
    I’m about to punch your ticket, so you might want to stop now.

  43. Bob says:

    Insult you!

    I think not! You sir are revealing your hair finger.

    I wrote this:

    “Very few of us have the time to actually read, dissect, meditate on, learn the history of, memorize and more the scriptures. So most of us rely on what others have written (or tell us) on various subjects and that becomes our “whole council of the Scripture.”

    Of which I count myself as one who does such.

    I don’t have the length of life to make even a dent in the depth of knowledge accumulated over the years. I would never say or infer I have any full counsel and I believe you did, even by implying you fully understand what Paul wrote.

    Leave? You know it’s the controversy and arguments (as long as they are civil) which keeps viewers returning.

    Smile a bit, the trumpet is sounding at sunset! But that’s the old ways, I guess.

  44. Bob says:

    Ewwww

    “Shut up!”

    Dudedddddddd….

    And I get a senior discount now at our local theatre.

  45. Bob says:

    Punch on, such an action says a lot!

    Night!

  46. Michael says:

    The new way is those that don’t like me or what I write and feel the need to be here simply to pick at me will be out of here.

    Disagree, debate, engage, all you want…but disrespect and sniping are done.

    I’ve got way too much on my plate and I’m not dealing with nonsense anymore.

  47. Uriahisaliveandwell says:

    It is by God’s attribute ( love, mercy, grace, etc.) that He grants grace by providing a means for us to be reconciled with Him. He provides the evidence to mankind that He does exists and that He is sovereign while also speaking to each and every person in numerous ways to turn towards Him and to walk according to what He has set forth.

    He provided the sacrifice to pay for sins which were committed prior to our conversion and also sins repented of after our conversion. Without repentance there is no forgiveness—-regardless of what some would have others believe. Prior to conversion, a person is in a constant state of sin, however, after conversion, this is not to be so. Rather, we are to be striving to be more and more like Him and less and less like that which we were or that which mirrored the world and he that is the epitome of all that is opposed to God.

    It is when we choose to accept that we are separated from Him and that to be reconciled, we must believe this and put away that which keeps us from following after Him, understanding that it is by His Holy Spirit our heart has now been born again and in this we can walk in the light as He is the light. Being born again by the spirit is like being filled afresh, made new, seeing things clearly, given new life to begin again, thinking differently and calling sin what it is: SIN. Our faith is given to us by what has been revealed to us and then brought to the crossroad of what we choose to believe or not to believe, then tested, tried, and proved. Faith grows as we ventured forward in sync with knowing and doing His will towards what we choose to abide in. If we abide in sin, then we will reap the whirlwind, but if we abide in the which is holy (thoughts, words, and deeds), then our faith grows even in the worse of circumstances and temptations that is part and parcel of being in this earthly vessel subjected by that which this world, as it is, has to offer.

    This is not a mindless faith, nor is it without an active participation on the part of the one who chooses to believes. Otherwise, Jesus would not have told us: Repent and believe.

    Belief is not passive. It is active and is reflected in just what and how we elect to go about what we say and do. Going to church, reading ones Bible, or taking communion does not evident belief, nor does it absolve anyone of their sins. But rather, it is in the heart that bears witness of such a conversion. When one make excuse for sin or to rely so much upon the grace card, then he or she has bought into this idea or in some circles, this theology that in and of themselves, they are not responsible for their sins, nor are they capable of doing anything except to sin against God and others. Scripture clearly tells us this is not so———and that all those who does overcome, will reap the promises that God has ordained simultaneously with providing by granting grace to those whom would repent and to follow after Him.

    We simply cannot say we believe if our lives reflect something else on a consistent and continuing basis. For if we truly repent, then that which was is no longer and that which we once were would no longer be and even if we have repented, that is truly, there would be evidence of such, even if it was a baby step. Do we fall and stumble, yes—but why—-because we are sinners—no, not necessarily, as it could be having to do with our hearts needing to be healed more, so that what step we do take forward, we can see progress and in this, hold fast that it is possible to let go of that which has held us into bondage for so long, thus causing us to dwell in darkness and bearing the fruit of that which God wants so much to see us set free from so that we can experience the victory, the joy, and the reality of the truth of what held and kept us from Him and the safe boundaries that keeps us safe, protected, and ever so close and near to Him.

  48. Em says:

    #47… just because i’m thinking on it… not sayin i’m teachin on it…
    i’m not sure we have a good grasp on the word “repent”… is it not a changing of one’s mind or lining up our thinking with the circumstances? acknowledging a sin in our lives, i.e., confessing it (at least to ourselves and God) and then repenting …?… somehow, we expect that means that we’ll never sin that sin again…
    but we do sin that sin again and someone says, “you need to repent….. do we repent again?
    no, i’ve already changed my mind, what i have to do is confess again: “Lord, forgive me again.” … don’t know how long we can string that out… probably until God says, “it looks like you need a little help” and the chastening begins

    just sayin cuz it’s open blog – somebody up there mentioned pulling the trigger? i shot two young buck deer yesterday, they were fighting in the horse paddock… paintballs

  49. Uriahisaliveandwell says:

    “that kept us from Him and the boundaries He has set forth to keep us safe, protected, and ever so close and near Him, while doing the good works which are exemplified as a result of having our hearts changed and now being led by the spirit and not of the flesh which once ruled over our thoughts that after a time such a perspective would be evident as well. We see things through a whole other perspective, that which dwells within us. And so, as Paul says: Not me that live, for I have put that t death, but rather He who lives within me.

    It is a choice: Repent and Believe. God has provided the way—-He does not force anyone. To make this conversion or transformation into that as being passive simply does not line up with the whole counsel of God. Salvation is available, but one must choose——and then to abide. Otherwise, one has not repented, nor have do they “really” believe. It’s like “love.” Love is not passive, nor is it an emotion, or feeling. Not real love, that is. Love is a verb, which means it is quite active and is able to bear witness by what fruit it bears. Sometimes, love appears to be quite mean and uncaring when in truth, it is being protective while keeping corruption and evil at bay. So too, “belief” bears out what is true in one’s heart. Not by what one says or declares, but by what one thinks, says, and then does. Thank about it.

  50. Uriahisaliveandwell says:

    Em,

    “but we do sin that sin again and someone says, “you need to repent….. do we repent again?
    no, i’ve already changed my mind, what i have to do is confess again: “Lord, forgive me again.” … don’t know how long we can string that out… probably until God says, “it looks like you need a little help” and the chastening begins”

    Your comment put a smile on my face as we all know how this does seem to be a non-stop process that takes us around the mountain, again and again, until something comes along internally or externally to get us to face the core of what drives us to keep chasing our own tail instead of just facing up to it and being done with it, so we can then climb over the mountain instead.

  51. Uriahisaliveandwell says:

    So if we are of the flesh, we do naturally that which is of the flesh, so too, being born, now of the Spirit, the natural outcome is that which manifested those fruits born as a result of having our hearts transformed and walking by faith, step by step becoming more and more mature and no longer being so easily taken or desirous of that which is of the flesh.

  52. Bob makes himself to be an expert on what the Jews do, did or think. Every comment anyone makes Bob reverts to a Jewish outlook. As I told him last week, his default is to interpret the NT by the Old which is backwards and not Christian.

    To this new point about who reads the scriptures etc, if he knew anything about Jews (even those in the first century) is that they rarely read scripture. Today, they read the Talmud and the Mishna and other writings of the 11th century teachers.

    Just as we read the commentaries.The Jews of the first century are not even close to the theologians of today.
    Michael – your writings are fine … even the ones I disagree with.

  53. From Uriah’s #47 – “He provided the sacrifice to pay for sins which were committed prior to our conversion and also sins repented of after our conversion. Without repentance there is no forgiveness—-regardless of what some would have others believe.”

    I won’t comment right or wrong – I will just say this could be straight out of the RCC Baltimore Catechism.

  54. Michael says:

    MLD,

    Thank you for the support.
    Bob has told me I’m sometimes abusive, so for his spiritual safety he’s now on moderation.

  55. Michael says:

    #54…That quote couldn’t be more Roman Catholic if the Pope himself said it.

  56. Em says:

    and, if i may presume to finish off the thought mentioned @ 54… the death of Christ paid the debt in full, the sin issue is no longer the barrier between man and his Creator…

  57. Steve Wright says:

    Shout out to Kevin H. after last night’s game (and a loss I think belongs on Coach Kelly who clearly did not have a plan on the go for it/ field goal attempt)

    Local radio talking about the “Tebow curse” yet??? Or will that just be the rest of Tebow nation around facebook?? 🙂

  58. Scott says:

    No, wasn’t the Chipster’s fault, it was the kicker’s fault. Straight on fga from 44 yds in a dome isn’t too much to ask from a professional kicker.

  59. Em says:

    since you’re talking football here, i’m feeling smug about predicting the Falcon’s win

  60. Kevin H says:

    Steve,

    The only Tebow reference I have seen/heard so far is someone asking if Tebow can kick field goals. But I haven’t been attuned to much talk yet. Probably will be much more of a need to talk people of the ledge than having to quell down we need Tebow talk.

    That kicker (Parkey) had a great season overall last year, but got shaky at the very end. He’s been so since. Hopefully it’s a mental block he can work through, but sometimes when kickers go bad they just never get it back. And, yes, Kelly did him no favors with his indecisiveness causing the kick to be rushed.

    But the biggest problem was the Eagles lack of preparedness in the first half. If not for that, they’re not having to rely on their kicker at the end of the game. Second year in a row they were atrocious in the first half of the opening game. They were able to come back and win last year (playing the woeful Jaguars), but not this time around. The Eagles still have a lot of potential, but we’ll have to see how this season plays out. Chip Kelly certainly did a lot of things “outside the book” this offseason in renovating the team, so it’ll be interesting to see the results. I’m hoping Kelly is more genius than madman.

  61. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    My Rams are in 1st place – don’t get to say that very often 🙂

  62. Kevin H says:

    MLD,

    The success of your teams must be Philly-driven. Jimmy Rollins, Chase Utley, Nick Foles… 😉

  63. Martin Luther's Disciple says:

    Kevin H LOL 😉

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