The Gospel and the Catholic Church by A.M. Ramsey: An Appreciation and Discussion: Michael Newnham and Duane W.H. Arnold

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17 Responses

  1. Michael says:

    I would also say that I think Eastern Christianity understands the Incarnation far better than the West…this isn’t just about Christmas…

  2. Jtk says:

    What is the best starting point to understand the Incarnation?

    You already jacked up my worldview re: border issues…

  3. Michael says:


    I wish I could clone you…
    This book is a good place to start…Duane would have further suggestions as well.

  4. Duane Arnold says:

    Ramsey’s book is a good place to start! It actually involves seeing the Incarnation as the root and ground of the nature of the Church. When Ramsey was studying the Greek Fathers, he noticed that the Church was hardly ever mentioned, but that the work and attributes of Christ were minutely examined. He had a “eureka moment” when he realized the reason – the Church was to be an extension of the Incarnation. What we see and read in the Gospels are not “suggestions for living the Christian life”. They are the reality of what the Christian life is all about – i.e. the Sermon on the Mount is not simply to be read, it is to be lived, as Christ lived his own words. Suddenly, the Eucharist is not a passive memorial of something past, but a living reality in the present. The Incarnation “was”… more importantly, it “is”.

  5. bob1 says:

    A question for the Anglicans, with no hidden agenda: )

    Would Ramsey have considered himself a member of the Anglo-Catholic wing?

  6. Michael says:


    Absolutely…though I feel he was more ecumenical than anything else…
    Duane knew him…and can answer better than I can.

  7. Em says:

    Haven’t read anything above that i can really disagree with. 😇

  8. Duane Arnold says:


    Yes, he was very much an Anglo-Catholic. That being said, he was also the primary mover in attempting to bring about a union between the Church of England and the Methodist Church. +Michael was simply loved and admired by the Orthodox. He also had a special bond with Pope Paul VI. On one remarkable occasion, the Pope pulled off his own episcopal ring and placed it on Ramsey’s hand. (I saw that ring so many times in talking with him and assisting him at the altar…) So, Michael is right, he had an ecumenical spirit…

  9. Babylon's Dread says:

    I have my students start with Athanasius himself and the vision of him given by John Behr and

    And I will be imbibing Ramsey

  10. Babylon's Dread says:

    I am looking forward to these posts and may be able to make my way through Ramsey as you release these.

  11. bob1 says:

    Very cool guy.

    Thanks, Duane!

  12. Captain Kevin says:

    Intriguing. Looking forward to more.

  13. Babylon's Dread says:


    Is that your academic thesis? Thanks for the link.

  14. Duane Arnold says:


    Part of it, rewritten and published by University of Notre Dame Press as part of their Christianity and Judaism in Antiquity series…

  15. pstrmike says:

    thanks for this, I’ll probably get Ramey’s book on kindle and start going through. Also, I appreciate the references of Athanasius, and will eventually get to those. I have a holding pattern of books form floor to ceiling that is over and above my post-doc work in spiritual direction.

  16. Duane Arnold says:


    As with you, my bookshelves overfloweth…

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